merledogs Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 While I'm sorry to read about this woman's tragic death I mainly agree with Victoria, we can't legislate for everything, or signpost everything. I agree. We always seem to feel a need to apportion blame when sometimes there is none. This was an obviously intelligent woman who got into trouble. Even if there were signs up saying that there may be cows in the field, would it have stopped her entering the field? She may have seen the cows before she entered and still gone in, nobody knows. Sometimes things just happen and nobody is to blame - not the farmer, nor the unfortunate woman, nor the cows, nor the dogs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cycas Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 Sometimes things just happen and nobody is to blame - not the farmer, nor the unfortunate woman, nor the cows, nor the dogs. Very true I'd also like to add that although yes, cows can be dangerous, we still have one of the safest environments in the world here, having carefully exterminated all the really dangerous wild animals. OK, if you are very unlucky you might meet a gang of cows (or horses) in a situation where you could get trampled, but these are still pretty placid domesticated animals : most of the time the main risk from cows is slipping in a cowflop. There are plenty of people who live in environments where you can unexpectedly come across a hippo, bear, seriously poisonous snake, tiger, or where your route home from the supermarket could be intercepted by a cyclone or forest fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happylittlegreensquirrel Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 There are plenty of people who live in environments where you can unexpectedly come across a hippo, bear, seriously poisonous snake, tiger, or where your route home from the supermarket could be intercepted by a cyclone or forest fire. very true , in the area where Dogstar did its first mobile dog clinic a woman was killed by a wild elephant in the middle of the day on the road by her house just days before our check up clinic and it was not the first time that had happened Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocky Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 If I see cows in a field I go into panic mode especially if it's the one with the footpath running through it , the dogs are totally unaware as is hubby, but me I have to walk ahead really quickly to get through to the other side so I can breathe again . We have had a run in with a load of horses, hubby got kicked in the leg and luckily he'd let both dogs go so they could run off. I don't like livestock, horses in fields it frightens the living daylights out of me and will happily walk an extra 5 miles around to avoid. Poor lady RIP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoebejo Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 One of the ladies on my forum has a farm in Somerset where she breeds horses & pedigree Belgian Blue cattle. Yesterday she posted this and I'm sure she wouldn't mind me cross-posting: Yet another tragedy of a woman being killed by cattle when walking her dogs, this time in N. Yorkshire. Regardless of the rights and wrongs of whether she was in the right place or whether suckler cows and calves should be in fields where the public walk, can I just say that if any of you are out walking your dogs, please DON'T walk through field with cows and calves in. For your own safety, give the field a wide berth and, if it's a Public Footpath, get in touch with the owner and ask if they are going to be there for any length of time and if it is safe to cross the field. I know you are all very well aware of the safety issues but I believe it's one of those issues that needs reinforcing every now and then!! Farmers do have the right to close footpaths for a certain number of days but they should advertise the fact that the footpath is temporarily closed. Our cows and calves are pretty dog proof, thankfully but I always make mine sit and stay well back if we get a fresh calver out in the fields and I always am bloody wary when I approach, as you never know just how protective a cow will be - even quiet dairy cows! Never get between your dog and the cow and, as has been widely publicised, always drop the lead to let the dog get out of the way on its own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JessandCos Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 Living in the new forest, there are always cows, calves, ponies, foals, pigs and deer wandering randomly - in the roads and anywhere else. I always try and give cows and ponies a wide berth, and my dogs are off lead all the time and they are used to being around them, and rarely bat an eyelid these days It is a sad story, but even around here, lots of the locals are terrified of cows , but animals are unpredictable and can easily be spooked, and all animals are naturally protective of their young. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sproggie14 Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 I don't understand the problem with asking farmers just to put up a sign. Not everyone is aware that cows can be a problem. I certainly wasn't. I spent much of my childhood on a farm and have always been comfortable around cows. In fact I remember once going for a walk (minus dogs) through a field of bullocks. The people I was with were scared and I couldn't fathom why and called the cows over to me to say hello. It never occured to me they were dangerous and I'm sure I'm not the only one. Of course cows need to be in fields. Logic suggests, reading this, that farmers would be sensible to put those cows most likely to attack (i.e. Mums) in fields without footpaths through them. But if any livestock is in a field with a footpath passing through then I do think a sign should be erected making this clear for the protection of people, dogs and the farm animals. It's not comparable to cars or cliffs as these are clearly dangerous but not everyone is aware of the dangers cows might pose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owl Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 The point of my rather rambling earlier post (sorry about that) is that if your dog is a pastoral breed you can end up in trouble if the dog doesn't run away when pursued by galloping cattle but herds and holds them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cycas Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 (edited) Of course cows need to be in fields. Sorry, but although many cows are kept that way, this is not universal. There are many areas that are grazed by cattle and horses that are not divided into fields. The New Forest, Dartmoor, Bodmin moor, Kit Hill, Clyne common and Cefn Bryn are ones that I have personally visited or lived near, but there are plenty more. Any legislation needs to account for these common or parkland areas as well as traditional dairy farms. Yes, you could put a sign up saying 'keep clear of cows with calves' - some of the more popular car parks on Dartmoor have warnings like that, but when the cows could be anywhere within a radius of several miles, and walkers could be using any one of a hundred different routes, and above all, when the vast majority of walkers and cows are able to keep clear of each other without injury, I don't feel the signs really need to be on every gate and stile, and the costs of putting them there and maintaining them would be considerable. To be honest, the big problems in those areas are not people or dogs being tromped by cows, but people who let their dogs go after sheep, and drivers that charge along the unfenced roads without consideration for the ponies. In other words, by far the most dangerous animals out there are the human beings. Edited June 23, 2009 by cycas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenOldie Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 I regularly walk my dogs up a footpath alongside a field in which cattle are grazed at certain times of the year, along with their calves. The field has a dry stone wall which a determined or charging cow could easily negotiate. My dogs are elderly and we all suffer from arthritis in varying degrees so in fact only my profoundly deaf collie x could move fast enough to escape. I therefore choose another route , particularly when calves are around, which is no hardship for any of us . I do struggle sometimes with the attitude of people who don't respect basic safety rules for themselves or their animals simply because they have a right to do something. I've lived in farming areas in the countryside in Wales and in Derbyshire and also know how difficult some farmers can be, but every year it seems we again read of potentially avoidable tragedies like this vet, lost at a young age to her family and to her profession . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sproggie14 Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 cycas I see your point but still think, where practical, signs should be up. Common land, moorland etc yes is a different issue. We saw some idiot letting their dogs run and chase the ponies in the New Forest a few weeks back and loads of them had foals Definitely in that situation the humans are the dangerous ones. I'm not sure on the solution there, perhaps wardens are needed and fines levied on those who do not control their dogs properly I know they have these in Richmond Park for example as I've reported people letting their dogs worry the deer myself in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReikiAnge Posted June 23, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 Just read of another incident where a guy has serious injuries after being trampled by cows not far from here - and he'd previously been trampled by a bull. Poor chap. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/somerset/8114658.stm I don't feel confident enough to walk in fields with cows in. When we had dogs growing up, we walked in areas that were livestock free - I don't really remember seeing any cows locally - and since being down here, we walk in places where cows are in neighbouring fields at certain times of the year, but I don't walk through those fields. I did end up in a field that the cows could have accessed, without remembering that they could and couldn't turn around quick enough when I did realise. I can't run to save my life (literally!) and I'm not sure the dogs would be too savvy either. As I said in the first post, apparently a local dog was trampled to death by cows too No idea of the circumstances but I think there were a number of dogs and one didn't make it out. I do understand some people are just idiots with their dogs too though. I do love cows - when they're on the other side of a fence! I suppose if it's something you've lived with all your life or you're not a worrier like I am, you just get on with it. I didn't start the thread to blame anyone, it was just a sad incident and reading it made me feel I'd made the right decision not to walk in certain fields, even when I see other dog owners doing it. I guess I would maybe have to rethink if we *had* to walk in fields with cows in but I'm not sure I could do it. I'd be terrified so it would not make for a relaxing walk. I remember a few years ago, walking home from work and stopping to take some photos of several bulls "charging" each other in a field (no footpaths through that one). It was amazing to watch and I was enjoying myself until they were headed in my direction and I realised all that separated me from a couple of bulls was a teeny ditch and a puny fence. Time to move along! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cycas Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 cycas I see your point but still think, where practical, signs should be up. As a voluntary code, certainly - I just can't see it working as an enforced thing. Of course the problem with a voluntary system is that the people who are arses about maintaining their footpaths are probably the same ones that won't bother putting up the signs. Most importantly, I think dog walkers should be aware that we cannot rely on signs or warnings and that we can't assume that a path across a field which is not signed is totally safe: we should be looking well ahead, keeping an eye on the animals we pass and using common sense, checking the exits and aware of where you could get out if you needed to, and so on. Won't make you 100% safe, but hey, nothing is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackmagic Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 David Blunkett suffered a broken rib after a cow fell on him http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article6453087.ece He will be on Radio 2 shortly, discussing this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheryl33 Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 she is the vet who works near me apparently Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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