Which Side Of The Coin Are You?

[Helly]

the other side of the coin then....

 

my family owns a residential home for the elderly. We cannot get local people to work for us. We pay above minimum wage, and higher than the coucil run homes which is unusual in itself. The hours are flexible. We were asked to give a trial to 2 Bulgarian carers. Same wage as the english staff, same hours, part of their wages taken from them to pay for private rent to live as they didnt qualify automatically for free housing contrary to popular beleif. They work bloody hard, they pay tax and NI and save what they can to send home.

 

A few weeks ago they announced they were going back to Bulgaria. They cant live with the racism and the bad feelings shown to them (not at work i hasten to add but outside of work but where they live) These 2 women worked as many hours as we could legally give them, worked bloody hard and rarely complained. Shame the local people in warrington, moaning about the foreigners getting their jobs didnt try the work ethics and attitudes of 'our foreighners'

 

Perhaps it is a regional thing, because in the north west, if you want a job its not that hard to get one. It seems to depend on what you are prepared to do to work, but if you are willing, the work is available.

[GSDFan]

Well....... I don't know where you live Taylor, but round here you would be able to get council flat or small house on a housing estate which very few people want to live on. If the immigrants get council housing then that is where they go.

 

As far as I know, most of the immigrants round here actually live in private rented houses but they share, lots of people to a house. The houses are usually owned by the local gangmasters for whom the immigrants work.

 

I think one of the main reasons the immigrants can afford to live here and work for less is they have more than one job. I can think of a few people who employ immigrants to work in the evenings. These immigrants will do an 8 or 9 hour day and then go on to do a 6 hour evening.

 

I don't personally believe that it's right that people need to do that but it does appear that many immigrants are prepared to and many British people aren't.

 

 

btw - if you can rent for £400 a month I'd like to live where you do A 2 bed private let round here starts at around £600

Edited November 16, 2007 by GSDFan

[meandmy4?]

Maybe it is we live in Dorset which I think has the lowest unemployment. But if you look in my previous post there are 14 Polish lads living in a 3 bed house at £1000 a month but divided 14 ways isnt much a month.. And I must add I am not anti polish my Mum sends round lasagnae for 2 of the lads as they eat absolutely cheap crappy food.

Edited November 16, 2007 by meandmy4?

[taylor]

All over the work is available .... the ability to keep a home is not !

 

Asking for little £20 a week would be rich in my home................... but if I didnt earn 1000 a month I woudnt have £20 to spend on luxury

 

perhaps the council with all the money they take from us should buy some of the property developers out ???

[GSDFan]

My hubby is an electrician so with all the new legislations he is ok with his job as he had to sit tests after tests for all kinds of stuff. BUT he works on a large building site from time to time and his boss on that job is a pig. He is employing all the young Polish men and he rents them one of his buy to lets which is a 3 bed house. He demands £1000 rent which seems alot but there is 14 Polish guys living in that house. I have met a few and they are lovely guys but they send most of the money home to their familys in Poland. So they dont have the same out goings as they rest of us. And what about all the young English guys who were the labourers but have been laid of as cant take the pay cut as they have bills and some young children to support.

What about them?

 

 

I don't really think you can blame an employer for wanting to pay as little as possible.

 

It would probably be possible for some of the English guys who have been laid off to find jobs in other parts of the country and send money home or they could house share like the immigrants.

 

I don't really think it is the immigrants who are the problem I think it is the unreasonable expectations of many English people when it comes to pay and standards of living.

[taylor]

Well....... I don't know where you live Taylor, but round here you would be able to get council flat or small house on a housing estate which very few people want to live on. If the immigrants get council housing then that is where they go.

 

As far as I know, most of the immigrants round here actually live in private rented houses but they share, lots of people to a house. The houses are usually owned by the local gangmasters for whom the immigrants work.

 

I think one of the main reasons the immigrants can afford to live here and work for less is they have more than one job. I can think of a few people who employ immigrants to work in the evenings. These immigrants will do an 8 or 9 hour day and then go on to do a 6 hour evening.

 

I don't personally believe that it's right that people need to do that but it does appear that many immigrants are prepared to and many British people aren't.

btw - if you can rent for £400 a month I'd like to live where you do A 2 bed private let round here starts at around £600

 

 

I have a one bed flat in the West Midlands, shared garden, 1st floor it costs £400 per month ..... I was rejected by all housing associations I applied to because I dont hav children but have a dog. I have worked all my life and still do.

[BillyMalc]

I agree with a lot of what's been said already, regarding Polish people taking jobs that British people won't take, and I really don't think it matters what nationality people think. Again another side of the coin: the vast majority of my work mates in my last job in Holland were British and Irish guys. The job was collecting mail orders of bulbs and garden ornaments etc in a massive warehouse. The hours were sh!te and we were treated like less than the dirt on your shoe, but the pay was good (or else they'd never ever have found anyone to work for them!). These guys lived cheaply and saved up for whatever it was they wanted to save up for.

I don't know what the situation is at the moment, but around the same time, if you wanted anything in a shop in Amsterdam you'd better speak English, because most people working in the shops didn't speak a word of Dutch.

What I'm trying to say is: for however many "foreign" people come to find work in this country, there is a substantial amount of Brits working abroad, that's just the way it is.

And would it make any difference if the job you wanted had been taken up by another Brit? I can't see it making any difference to your budget whether a British or foreign nationality has got the job that you want

[EGAR]

Totally agree with BillyMalc.

[meandmy4?]

"It would probably be possible for some of the English guys who have been laid off to find jobs in other parts of the country and send money home or they could house share like the immigrants."

 

Why should we have to leave our familys and friends and do that we have lived here all our lives.

 

And the reason I believe it matters is employers are not paying Brits the same as the Polish.

Edited November 16, 2007 by meandmy4?

[Trudi]

I have a twin sister - she has never worked longer the minimum time possible, usually a few weeks or months and then has the next few years off to recover but whenever the benefit peeps have a clamp down on skivers she always manages to find work, so the jobs are out there for people prepared to work.

 

She has a council flat, sky tv, broadband, goes abroad on her holidays - all paid for by me and others like me.

 

Employment has nothing to do with origin of birth and I am ashamed to be part of a country that looks down on others who are doing the best they can to improve the lives of their own families just because they weren't born here

 

Employment is not a right - just because you were born in this country does not make you the best person for the job, I would prefer to work alongside someone who wants to work than someone who feels they are owed a better standard of living because they are British

[blackmagic]

A friend of ours has a mushroom farm. He employs Roumanians, who consider they are very well paid on the minimum agricultural wage.

 

They are the best workers he has had.

 

Whole families, two or three generations are here. One is a bank manager in Roumania, but earns far more here on the minimum wage.

 

Another has a bicycle shop. He has employed someone to run the shop for him while he is working here. He goes back home once a month to check eveything is okay.

 

Recently a man was lamenting to me how he couldn't get a job, because all these foreigners were coming to this country and taking the jobs.

 

He then proceeded to tell me that he had worked for years in Germany and wished he had stayed there as the pay was good. He only came home because his father had gone into hospital.

 

So, it was okay for him to go to Germany and take a job, but it was not alright for a foreigner to come to Britain and take a job.

[EGAR]

After WWII many Spanish, Turkish and Italians were enticed to come and work in Germany as the Labour Force was lacking male workers due to the war. They came, started working, settled down and sent money home until they could let their families come over to Germany. 20 years later when there was a German male work force available, they were no longer wanted.... Many problems arose from this and now we have the third generation of these Immigrants living in Germany. They have as much right for a job/house etc as everyone else IMHO.

[GSDFan]

"It would probably be possible for some of the English guys who have been laid off to find jobs in other parts of the country and send money home or they could house share like the immigrants."

 

Why should we have to leave our familys and friends and do that we have lived here all our lives.

 

And the reason I believe it matters is employers are not paying Brits the same as the Polish.

 

 

I think people have a choice, either accept the standard of living they can get where they live or move area, change jobs or do more jobs.

 

I think it would matter if the employers were paying the Polish more than the Brits but I hardly think it is unfair discrimination when most of the Poles or other immigrants will be paid less than the Brits would be prepared to work for.

[scotslass]

Why should we have to leave our familys and friends and do that we have lived here all our lives.

 

For centuries, people have had to move to where the work was. That's precisely why I grew up in a mining town in Scotland instead of rural Ireland or a Hebridean island.

 

No-one suggested that British people should move to another country - only that they should follow the work, as other people have to do. We do have choices; our idea of poverty (in the UK) is a joke compared to the situation in some other countries.

 

Immigrants can't win, it seems. If they can't find work, they're work-shy; if they do work, they're taking jobs away from "British" people.

[Alison]

I think one of the main reasons the immigrants can afford to live here and work for less is they have more than one job. I can think of a few people who employ immigrants to work in the evenings. These immigrants will do an 8 or 9 hour day and then go on to do a 6 hour evening.

This is true where I live too although there's not an immigrant in sight. I think some feathers would be ruffled if a British Catholic family moved in here!

 

An awful lot of my "unskilled" friends can only enjoy a reasonable standard of living by doing several jobs. They may have nice cars and be able to go out 3 times a week for a pint, but many live in homes tied to one of their jobs - they lose their job and they lose their house. I could never work the hours that they do; up at 05:30 for morning milking, a quick cuppa then off to muck out a rich person's horses, exercising those horses then away to serve behind the bar of the local at lunch time. Back to rug the horses up, a bite to eat and just enough time for a quick shower before waitressing or pot washing at a rural gastro pub until 10pm. They all have to work either Christmas Day, Boxing Day or New Year's Eve too.

 

I would prefer to work alongside someone who wants to work than someone who feels they are owed a better standard of living because they are British

I'd be happy to work alongside anyone with a strong work ethic, irrespective of where they were born. I don't think one can generalise either - there as many foreign chancers/dossers as there are indigenous British ones unfortunately.