What Would You Do?

[KathyM]

At least with an adult rescue with a 'formed' personality you know pretty much what you are taking on.

 

Playing the Devil's advocate here, I would say that isn't always the case. Many dogs don't show traits in rescue or foster homes that they show after longer times within a home. That would be the same for an adult rescue or for an adult ex breeder though.

[JoC]

I suppose that the bottom line for me is that it is me who will live with the dog for the next 15 or so years of my life. I will be the one dealing with any problems. So it is up to me to make whatever decision I feel is suitable for my household.

That sums it up for me.

 

I know people who are against rescues because they make it easy for people to get rid of their dogs. If you didn't have the option of 'rehoming your dog with lovely caring people who live on a farm etc etc' and had to take the dog to vets to be pts yourself, people would take the responsibility of dog ownership more seriously. I don't personally agree with that, but just as it's not their place to judge people who choose a rescue, it's nobodies business to judge those who don't.

[Maria]

I don't think buying a pup from a responsible breeder is a cast iron guarantee of anything. Someone near to me brought a chocolate cocker pup, researched first, took advice and went to a recommended breeder. Did everything suggested to find a well bred pup, with health tested parents.

After a few weeks it became apparent that the pup had something wrong with it (health wise), which in turn affected it's temperament. The breeder did not hesitate to take the dog back when they decided they could not cope with the poor mite in the long term. I can understand people who aren't aware of the rescue situation in this country going to good breeders, but I really can't understand why people who are aware still choose to do so.

Good breeding / genetics don't always have the intended effects - even in humans - how many people do you know who have raised several children / are good parents, but one has gone off the rails / is uncontrollable?

As for me, I couldn't live with myself if I bought a pup when I know that many dogs die every day through lack of good homes. I don't understand or necessarily agree with 'showing' (having had a friend involved and hearing some of her tales - which is also why I would never darken the doors of somewhere like Crufts).

We have cockers now,but neither of us has a particular 'must have' dog- and ironically our cocker with the 'worse' background (Smudge, ex puppy farmed girl), has a far better temperament than Boysie, who had lived in a home all his life.

I suppose it depends on your reason for having a dog - ours are purely for companionship, and a good fit for our lifestyle, so we can be sure we meet their needs.

[elricc]

I looked at Erwine's picture just now and I thought of this thread, I think that encapsulates why i could never buy a dog, while little souls like him and his daughter look for a home and all the thousands to whom a home never comes. I too can never understand how people who know that thousands die would choose to buy a dog.

Also just because your dog that you have bought has a wonderful home, what about the rest of the litter, we have all read accounts and some have personal knowledge of extremely good pedigree well bred dogs etc etc who have ended up in horrendous situations.

[cockergirl]

I suppose that the bottom line for me is that it is me who will live with the dog for the next 15 or so years of my life. I will be the one dealing with any problems. So it is up to me to make whatever decision I feel is suitable for my household.

 

I agree with this. I have a specific breed - working cockers - firstly because I love everything about them and secondly because I actually do work them. At the moment I have a breeder bought boy and a rescue girl. I will have at least one more of these dogs in the next year or so and I honestly don't know if it will be a rescue or from a breeder. I have specific requirements because my ultimate aim is to compete my dogs in field trials and not every working cocker is going to make the grade for this. No the world is not going to end if I don't work or compete my dogs but it's what I want to do and I don't have to make excuses about that or justify it to anyone.

 

I have been very lucky with my rescue girl in that she has been trained to work and is a superb worker, we were out a lot over the season but she will never make a trialling dog because her early training was not quite good enough. Whereas hopefully my breeder bought boy who has been trained from the age of 6 weeks with his breeder (introduced to birds, the whistle etc) and then this continued with me since he was 8 weeks might, just might, make the grade in the next year or so. This doesn't mean that I value or love him any more than Tilly, but it's something that means a lot to me.

 

So when I am ready for another working cocker I will look in rescue and if there is a working cocker puppy or even a young dog which has had at least some basic training then I would definitely consider rehoming them, but if not then I will either go back to the fantastic breeder who gave me my boy or else go to an equally responsible and committed breeder if he is not planning any litters. I know the breed and I know off the top of my head which breeders I would go to.

 

However, I can safely say that I would not consider getting any other breed of dog from a breeder because they would be pets pure and simple. My previous dog was a GSD and when I get another one of those one day it will be a rescue I would also love a Cav and a whippety type and they would also most definitely be rescues.

[~Canis-Equus~]

Why do we like the dogs we do?

 

Hell could freeze over and i wouldnt consider rehoming a labrador. Not the dog for me, they dont suit my life, i dont 'get on' with them, they would not be the dog id look for. I wouldnt turn one away on the doorstep, id foster and find a rescue place or a home for one, but i wouldnt keep one.

 

Does that make me bad?

 

Ive done the same with a couple of terriers, again, small terriery things are not the dog for me.

 

Tall pointy things are - when i got Abby i was actually discussing a deerhound puppy with a reputable breeder. Abby came along instead. If id not been considering another dog, i wouldnt have got abby as i wouldnt have mentioned the idea to anyone and id not have heard of her.

 

Next time round, i will buy a deerhound from a breeder.

 

Probably thats a very selfish thing, but i have three dogs out of four that are rescues (4 is dill and i bought HIM directly due to rescue nastiness, i passed a home check then failed it as i was thought to be friends with the 'wrong' person. As it happens i wasnt but too late really....). Perhaps i should have not bought dill and sat here lurcherless due to someone elses bitchyness. But i didnt - these days i would have gone about things differently i guess.

 

After that, i will have another rescue, and i intend to have rescues around as long as i can have dogs (and that OUGHT to be another fifty years).

 

I dont think id buy a pup if the breed was common in rescue, unless that breed was a particularly difficult, ie not a dog for someone with no experience of the breed.

[Muriel]

Deerhound Club Rescue

Mrs S L Reynolds, Solihull, West Midlands. Tel: 0121 742 1697

 

Southern Dandie Dinmont Terrier Club Rescue

Mrs G Tinsley, Wellington, Somerset. Tel: 01823 663436

 

Corgi - Cardigan and Pembroke

 

Welsh Corgi Rescue Service

Mrs F S Baker, Sec/Co-ordinator, Tonbridge, Kent. Tel: 01892 723401

Mr C Locksmith, lpswich, Suffolk. Tel: 01473 624966

Mrs M M Hope, Brighton, East Sussex. Tel: 01273 550902

Mrs E Rhodie, Chance Inn Cupar, Fife, Scotland. Tel: 01334 828517

Mr & Mrs Shayers, New Denham, Middx. Tel: 01895 233900

Miss C Titchen, Bournemouth Dorset. Tel: 01202 428868

Mrs F Toman, Craigavon, Co Armagh, N Ireland. Tel: 01762324182

Mr R Wood, Shenfield, Essex. Tel: 01277 211016

 

Pug Dog Welfare Association

Mrs S Smith, Secretary, Aston, Sheffield. Tel: 0114 287 4245

Mr E Herold, Treasurer, Brighton. Tel: 01273 600375

Mrs A Mount, Buckden, Huntingdon. Tel: 01480 810805

Miss E W McCreath, Purley, Surrey. Tel: 020 8660 2955

Mrs J Manifold, Pumpsaint, Llanwrda, Dyfed. Tel: 01558 650589

Mrs E Tullett, East Dean, East Sussex. Tel: 01323423249

Mrs S Welch, Lingfield, Surrey. Tel: 01342 892061

 

Wales and West of England Pug Dog Club Rescue

Mrs M Lord, Clunderwen, Dyfed. Tel: 01437 563671

Mrs I M Peace, Barry, South Glamorgan. Tel: 01446 751060

Mrs J John, Secretary, Nant-Y-Moel, Mid Glamorgan. Tel: 01656 842292

Mrs M Lee, Tavistock, Devon. Tel: 01822 855337

 

Rhodesian Ridgeback

 

Midlands and Northern Rhodesian Ridgeback Club Rescue

Mrs S M Firth, Oldham, Lancs. Tel: 01457 872520

 

Rhodesian Ridgeback Welfare Trust

Mr B Davies, London. Tel: 020 7485 0691

 

Southern Rhodesian Ridgeback Association

Mrs Marie Rose Crunden, Hythe, Kent. Tel: 01303 268305

 

Clumber Spaniel Club Rescue

Mrs S Williams (Co-ordinator), Heathfield, Sussex. Tel: 01435 812210

 

Field Spaniel Rescue

Mrs D Channon, Uckfield, East Sussex, Tel: 01825 840211

Email: [email protected]

 

Sussex Spaniel Association Rescue Scheme

Mrs E Shewell, Wellingborough, Northants. Tel: 01933 665562

 

 

I think I've covered all the ones mentioned, but can't be bothered going back through the thread again, but yesterday all breeds mentioned as not coming in to rescue were there, simply google for the breed rescue of your choice.

http://www.dogpages.org.uk/breeds.htm

[Red Rotties]

I have Perry the pug, his possible daughter Wilma came through WAW too, I know of a pug cross that went through another rescue think it was hwar and freshfields had one through last month

[fee4]

personally-my choice of companion is plentiful-hounds-so its not a thought regarding buying a dog.

 

what im about to say may not be popular-apologies:

 

i do however disagree that you need a specific breed-i think that comes down to a want not a need

 

you may wish your dog to fullfill a specific purpose-in which case you want a type not a specific breed.I maybe wrong-but im not aware of a breed whose skills & attributes are such that it could not be duplicated by another.

 

ie i want a dog to do gun work-lab/goldie/flatcoat

 

i want a dog to keep the rat population down-JRT/norwich/dacksie

 

i want a dog to herd sheep-border collie/aussie shepherd/smooth collie

 

i want a dog to deter burglars-GSD/rottie/dobe/gaint schnauzer

 

i want a dog who will bugger off & come back when they think about it!-saluki/afghan

 

 

i can fully understand wanting a type-and yes i can understand wanting a specific breed-but i think it is a want not a need.

 

fee

[Fiona711]

Breeder / Rescue choice is just that a personal choice depending on circumstances etc . I can see both sides of this but it saddens me that some people who have bought a puppy from a reputable breeder for what ever reason feel they have to justify why they did it .

 

Some of you will be aware i bought Taz and Akira from breeders and Storm is a rescue maybe you dont like it but at the end of the day i made the right choices for me and my family every time and none of the choices i made were on a whim , i dont feel guilty in the slightest and yes theres a lot of dogs in rescues up and down the country being involved in rescue i know that but as i said it is very much a personal choice and when the time comes when i might want another dog to join my family i will look at both options but i wont say that now i am involved in rescue i wont ever buy a puppy again as i honestly dont know whats around the next corner , circumstances change and depending where i am at that point in my life it could be either .

 

Some breeds are harder to understand and handle than others , not just due to size but breed traits and personalities are so different in every breed so i would much rather have a breed that i have researched and know a fair bit about and understand than try taking on a dog that was in rescue that i knew nothing about as potentialy that could be a disaster and could cause a lot of problems .

 

It must be lovely to have the confidence to take on an adult dog of any breed and not be worried about any issues the dogs could have particularly in a house where there are children . I admire people who can do that but it's not something i could or would do without doing a lot of research and even then i would think long and hard about it first .

 

Each to their own

 

Fiona xx

[JoC]

But that's it with all dogs, nobody 'needs' a dog at all. If dogs were banned, then theere would be no rescue, is that what people want?

 

The fact is, that dogs bred by responsible, caring breeders are very unlikely to end up in rescue. The lab puppies mentioned in this thread do not end up in rescue because the temperament was dodgy, the end up in rescue because a family with 2.4 kids and a range rover want a lab to complete their family, but to be walked once a week and only if it's sunny. When the puppy jumps up, play bites, steals food (as lab puppies do) the family want rid of their 'perfect' puppy. GOOD breeders don't home puppies to families like that, and it's often the people, rather than the pups fault.

 

But then what about a second hypothetical family, they have 2.4 kids and a range rover but understand the responsibilities of dog ownership and are willing to train it, walk it, not let the kids tease it etc. Why should they be criticised for choosing a carefully bred puppy who's socialisation has already started, than be expected to take family A's puppy who's already learned to jump up, steal food and be a bit hand shy, who's missed out on the vital early weeks of socialisation etc. Why should they be made to feel bad if they dont' choose a rescue pup with unknown parentage, who might have inherited their grandfathers iffy temperament or their mothers undiagnosed hip dysplacia?

 

Family A, and the breeders of their puppy are the ones who cause the rescue problem, not the family that want to offer a loving home to a dog that's already had the best start in life, and aim to continue the breeders socialisation and training throughout the dogs life. Puppies aren't all a blank slate, in my puppy classes I see pups from 12 weeks old onwards, and their genetic temperament is obvious by that age. They are shy or confident, intelligent or goofy, playful or quiet etc. I've turned around many a nervous dog (from bad breeders, I admit) but they will always be 'glass half empty' dogs rather than optimistic, half full types. They will always be fearful of new things, so need to be socialised to everything while they're still young. Other pups have naturally been more confident, things can fall behind them and they respond wwith 'ooh what's that? can I eat it or play with it? if not I'm not interested' rather than the more nervous 'whats that? is it going to kill me?' types.

 

I will always have rescue dogs, I will always want a 'glass half empty' type of dog, and I will always want to offer a home to a challenging, needy dog. That doesn't mean I'll never buy my dream portuguese water dog from a breeder. In fact, my dream pwd will be well bred and carefully socialised and be a 'assume it's going to play with me' type of dog, DreamDog will help me to rehabilitate nervous, fearful dogs and teach them the world is a safe place. She will be *in addition* to my rescue dogs, not instead of.

 

This is quite a controversial point, but if you're saying that a breeder bought pup takes the place of a rescue dog, could you not say that those who don't have a houseful of dogs are condemning others to death? I've only got 2, but other people with a similar size house and garden to me have 5 or 6 dogs, am I sentencing 3 or 4 dogs to death because it's my *choice* to only stick to 2? Why do I need only two?

 

I think everyone has to do what's right for them and their family, both 2 footed members and 4.

[murtle]

I'll stick with my puddy tats - and I'd take which ever needed a home, although the two I have now were purchased from someone who was mortified that her puss cat had babies as she had been promised her cat was neutered. Always regretted not taking all 4 of them, but love my two. Only reason I looked outside of cat rescue, is because where I was looking at the time, cat rescue weren't interested in anyone living in a flat they now have lovely outdoor world to play in cause we moved....

 

Would I buy again, no not if I could help it, but then I'm not fussy about who owns me

 

I realise cats are different to dogs

 

x x x

[ReikiAnge]

There are lots of "glass more than half full dogs" coming out of rescue though Jo, pups and older dogs. Out of our three, was until recently four, dogs, all of which are rescue (well one was a private rehoming, but from a family not coping, not from a breeder), three of those four are/were definitely glass half full, dogs.

 

Only one is a nervous creature, the others adore everyone they meet, especially if there might be the chance of food or a cuddle and I can't imagine them being more accepting of meeting new people if they'd come from the best breeder in the world. They haven't been without their challenges but even the pup we had as a first family dog when I was a child, who came from a good breeder, was a challenge for many years in comparison to other pet dogs we knew, yet she was lovely and very well behaved in the end. She was naturally more wary of men than two of our current three rescues are though. I doubt very much that any of our rescue dogs were well bred.

 

Also, while my feelings are that *I* could never go and buy a puppy knowing there are dogs in pounds/rescue who will die if they don't find a rescue space/home, I do understand that others make different decisions for different reasons I also understand that those who go to good breeders are not to blame for there being dogs in pounds/rescues/being pts. That I believe is the fault of irresponsible breeders and some of those who buy puppies from them - and our government for not taking any action.

 

I wouldn't like to see all dogs banned, but I would like to see a vast reduction in the number of dogs in rescue and being pts in pounds. That stems from too many dogs being bred and there not being enough good homes. Until the day the government sits up and takes action against puppy farmers and irresponsible owners and prevents some of these dogs being bred, the only chance to reduce the number of dogs being pts and staying in rescue for long periods, is for good dog owners to give them a home.

[KathyM]

To be honest, I think in the cases of responsible owners looking for a specific dog for their needs, it's not fair to say if they can't get one in rescue then going to a breeder takes a space that could've been for a rescue dog. Obviously if someone can't find what fits their family/needs in rescue they won't be taking a rescue dog anyway, so I don't think there's any argument that they're contributing to the deaths of dogs.

 

If Baz and I ever get another dog it will be a giant breed, preferably something along the lines of an English Mastiff/similar. Large/giant breeds fit our family's needs, and thanks to Dharma we have some experience with bigger dogs. Now add the kids and cats into the mix (and Dharma were we to consider this before she passes, which is unlikely but tempting *lol*). An adult male giant breed is less likely to be in rescue for no reason. I'm not saying it's impossible to find a huuuuge well socialised cat, dog and kid friendly mastiff, but that's it's not as likely. Then you find that some rescues will have restrictions on rehoming these dogs with kids. It cuts down the chances of us finding our dream dog in rescue. Not that I wouldn't try, I would a million times over. But I'd have to have some kind of certainty of temperament at least. The best way for that is to bring one up myself, and in the times I've been on the boards I have only seen one giant breed litter of pups up for rehoming, and that was 5 or 6 years ago (Bev's Pyreneans). I have seen adults since though.

[Jacobean]

It's funny you should mention the amount of dogs in the household Jo. I came away from looking at this thread thinking. Ok so I'm in the wrong because I have 3 rescue dogs but 1 from a reputable breeder who keeps in touch with her babies. My limit is actually supposed to be 3. Other people have 1 maybe 2 dogs. But that's ok cos they are rescues and not from breeders. I have 3 rescues here but am still in the wrong. So there's another question how come I'm naughty when I have 3 and someone else only has 1. I have to have helped the situation more surely This is all meant tongue in cheek.

 

All of the rescues I have taken in have brought me huge problems which I have glady taken on board, worked with and in most areas have sorted out. They haven't been at all easy and others aren't lucky enough to have the level of commitment that I have had to help and see mine through. I haven't got children. I work but have no family pressures that others have. If I had children the 3 rescues I have at the moment could not have come into my house. It's as simple as that. They were not safe to be around children and I still wouldn't trust one of them now even in my presence.

 

Some of the breeds I like aren't that common in rescue and you do have to be careful which you take. I am now in my 40's and I've had my fair share of problem dogs. By the time my Viz go I will be in my 50's and probably wanting an easier life. I will be more choosey I imagine about the dogs I take in. I don't know I could be wrong. My Spinone went through breed rescue into a home that, like me, had never had a Spinone. She bounced quicker than a boingy thing because she had some serious problems to get over. The rescue had been advised of this. Not all breed rescues are like this I know but some are and some won't take back dogs if you have a problem as we have seen on this board in recent times. Labradors etc by the way are nothing like Vizslas.

 

The bottom line to all this unfortunately is we will all continue to have this discussion while members of forums like this. The underlying problem will not be resolved. There will always be hundreds of dogs in rescues and pounds.

 

The other thing I would like to add is rescues take in unwanted adult dogs and pups from disreputable breeders/puppy farms but that's seen as ok. All because these breeders have people over a barrel worrying what will happen to the dogs if they don't get them out of there and also because they want to help them get the proper care.

 

If life was oh so different and there were only reputable breeders we wouldn't be having this conversation at all. Instead of questioning each other what can we do about stopping disreputable breeders? Probably not a lot. But at the end of the day all this is down to them. If only every one who has a dog with a litter was like my friend. I know where Bracken's sister and brothers went and what's happening to them all now. They've turned out into a wonderful bunch of well balanced individuals. My friend will take any of them back at any time. It's in their contract for one.

 

It is not our fault that there is a huge problem with unwanted dogs in this country. Most if not all on this board have rescued dogs so we have tried to help what is an impossible situation. I haven't condemned any dog to die and have actually helped to save quite a few, including the one I did take in from the pound.

 

The other thing is I wouldn't want to see uncommon breeds become extinct because everyone suddenly decided that they should go get a rescue dog. All breeds are different which is why good rescues spend a lot of time making sure a home offer is suitable to a particular type. I happen to like a lot of different breeds but take on board that others don't and that is up to them.

Edited February 25, 2007 by Jacobean