blackmagic Posted December 1, 2009 Report Share Posted December 1, 2009 On the Jeremy Vine Show on Radio 2 one caller said that he considered himself an expert on these cases, as he followed them all closely. He could not see how anything like that could happen in his house He had a Pressa Canaria x Cane Corso that was a trained guard dog. But, it was soft as butter with his nieces and nephews, aged 2, 4 and 6, who climbed all over it and pulled its ears. It would never do anything and IT WAS A TRAINED GUARD DOG. Jeremy Vine asked him if that was not the scenario of the day before the dog did react. The guy replied No, it would never do anything. It was trained and he considered himself an expert dog owner. Apart from the danger to these children from that dog, no matter how 'well trained', suppose these nieces and nephews go and behave like that to another dog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happylittlegreensquirrel Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 my blood runs cold every time I hear phrases like "the dog will let the children do anything to him/here" "the kids can climb all over it and pull its tail / ears" its almost as if some adults revel in the fact they have dogs that are being subjected to inappropriate behaviour by children who are not being given suitable guidance in the treatment of another living being its not fair on the dogs nor on the children and its always both of those groups that pay the price when things go wrong this is a general comment and viewpoint not a response to this particial case Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
celeste Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 On the Jeremy Vine Show on Radio 2 one caller said that he considered himself an expert on these cases, as he followed them all closely. He could not see how anything like that could happen in his house He had a Pressa Canaria x Cane Corso that was a trained guard dog. But, it was soft as butter with his nieces and nephews, aged 2, 4 and 6, who climbed all over it and pulled its ears. It would never do anything and IT WAS A TRAINED GUARD DOG. Jeremy Vine asked him if that was not the scenario of the day before the dog did react. The guy replied No, it would never do anything. It was trained and he considered himself an expert dog owner. Apart from the danger to these children from that dog, no matter how 'well trained', suppose these nieces and nephews go and behave like that to another dog. There was a similar comment made by some loony on the Daily (hate) Mail's web site, she leaves her crawling baby alone with her Staffie, and there's no way, according to her, that the dog would harm the baby,she should be reported to social services, in my book thats tantamount to neglect Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gillyb3 Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 Oh my god what is that women thinking of (celeste). The thing that really annoys me about that is say that the dog did bite her baby then the poor baby and the dog suffer it all. Its no good crying after the event. Gillian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kats n greys Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 This was posted on DP and I thought it worth cross-posting here Humane Society - End Dog fighting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dawnie Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 Whenever anything like this happens i get a deja vu of what i was told by the police when my 3 dogs were attacked by a great dane - they said, and i quote, "dog on dog attacks are natural things" and they did NOTHING! How sad that another life has been lost - i blame the irresponsible owners and the authorities, tighter laws need to be introduced now ie licensing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
celeste Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 This was posted on DP and I thought it worth cross-posting here Humane Society - End Dog fighting. Pretty inspiring stuff, fat chance of the RSPCA doing anything similar here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rip and cap Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 I disagree. Ellie Lawrensen didn't die because the police failed. She died because of irresponsible ownership and a law that failed. The police enforce the law, they don't write it. As far as I can see, the police are not blaming the breed, the media are doing that! The police have merely stated what breed [type] the dog was. I strongly agree with your reply here but wasn't the police informed about Kyle simpsons dog prior to the attack. Thats what i was refering too when i said the police failed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumpole Posted December 2, 2009 Report Share Posted December 2, 2009 Whenever anything like this happens i get a deja vu of what i was told by the police when my 3 dogs were attacked by a great dane - they said, and i quote, "dog on dog attacks are natural things" and they did NOTHING! sorry to hear about your dog being attacked but what you were told was correct dog on dog attacks do not fall into the dda now if you had been bitten or had told them you were in fear that you might be personally harmed that IS included in the dda. you could also have filed a civil suit under the 1871 dogs act on the grounds that the dogs were acting dangerously. or requested that your local dog warden did, howevwer if both your dog and the other dogs were offlead at the time it could be deemed that all were behaving dangerously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillyMalc Posted December 3, 2009 Report Share Posted December 3, 2009 I hated what they did in 2007. I hated the Chief Con for holding the amnesty and the officers for following orders. I hate that children have died and that people suffered serious injury in dog attacks and that people ALWAYS blame the breed. I hate that people think it'll never happen to them. It can and it does! I hate the law and I hate injustice. This law is unjust. Most of all I hate ignorance and ignorance is what keeps on killing children. We have a law that states that certain breeds and their types are illegal to own. What we need is to educate people on responsible and safe dog ownership no matter what the breed. We need to understand why [in a case such as this] a dog has bitten and then gone on to kill. We need to know what triggered that [and other] attacks and we need to teach people how to properly raise and care for a dog, stay safe and keep others safe. These incidents will happen time and time again unless we can educate everyone. Not just dog owners but everyone. Kids learn that if you put your fingers in the fire they'll get burnt. Whats so different about teaching them that if you poke a dog in the eye, eventually it'll bite? [thats an example, I don't personally know of any child poking a dog in the eye] Whatever has happened in this tragic case will eventually come out. What will be learned from it? God help the next child if the answer is nothing. Mel, I thought that that whole post was just absolutely brilliant, I've just highlighted the bits that stand out for me. I so hope that you will get and take the opportunity to say this on national telly - this is what people will need to hear! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
celeste Posted December 3, 2009 Report Share Posted December 3, 2009 Said on the news this afternoon that the uncle was going to be questioned by the police and there was a chance he could be charged with manslaughter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumpole Posted December 3, 2009 Report Share Posted December 3, 2009 i do hope not as they tried and failed with ellie lawrenson when they would have got a neglect conviction there is little possibility of conviction for manslaughter against grandson especially as he wasnt even there at the time (nor for some time previously. though there may be a possibility of conviction against grandma if the facts of this case when available show that she was in any way negligent in her care of the child. personally the best shot i think they have is to get ownership and on uncle and if proof can be found breeding too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
celeste Posted December 3, 2009 Report Share Posted December 3, 2009 personally the best shot i think they have is to get ownership and on uncle and if proof can be found breeding too News said that wasn't going to happen unfortunately, just have to wait and see I guess.I do personally feel someone should be held accountable, and for there to be a greater sentence than the paltry jail time that was handed out to Ellie Lawrenson's uncle, surely there must be a law that would cover these tragedies with a bit more weight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumpole Posted December 3, 2009 Report Share Posted December 3, 2009 i see where you are coming from but the fact is how can he be held culpable when he was not the one in control of the circumstances he had been away from home for three weeks so had no say in the child coming to stay and no control of what went on in the house on that evening wheras grandma allowed the dog to remain in the house and was the person in posession at the time, and allowed the child to stay and was in control of events leading to the incident. i realise that the dog as an illegal dog should not have been there but what about the legal registered pit bulls, they were allowed on the register because a judge was satisfied they did not pose a danger to public safety under the amendment, they do not need to be muzzled in the home so if one of those were to kill a child does the judge get charged with manslaughter because he/she allowed it to be there for that matter does the solicitor who helped bring it home, or me and melp who arranged a defence, or the behaviourist, or the police dlo who said it was a nice dog also get charged with manslaughter. the dog was unregistered and therefore illegal but that doesnt make its owner guilty of manslaughter the concern is the reason other area forces did not charge the owners of the dogs who killed other children which were not pit bulls with manslaughter (or even those present when the incident occurred for that matter) was presumably because there was no realistic chance of conviction especially if they were responsible for neither dog nor child at the time. Yet in this case they are considering charging the owner yet not the person in control of the situation ETA That was just a general WTF rant and not in any way aimed at you celeste Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
celeste Posted December 3, 2009 Report Share Posted December 3, 2009 Didn't think it was at me Mel ..... I do agree,I wasn't specificly meaning the uncle should be charged, just whoever is deemed to have been responsible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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