gremlin22 Posted October 15, 2009 Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 I was reading the topic about new licensing laws in ireland and the bit about reductions for neutered dogs.. and it got me thinking..how would you prove a bitch was spayed? if it's done a long time ago there is often no scar, and if the dog has been rehomed through a rescue or stray kennels you might not be able to track what vets neutered. Also when a bitch comes into rescue,currently unless there is an obvious scar, the only way to be sure the dog is spayed is to open them up to check, obviously carrying quite a few risks to the dog dependant on age and health.. so my question is why can't vets tattoo a little x or something onto the belly of a dog, or even a traceable code or soemthing linking it back to the vets.? it could be the same code as the microchip vet code. it only has to be tiny and the fur could grow back over it, but it would make it so much easier to tell if a dog is neutered or not.it shouldn't affect show dogs as they have to be entire don't they? or is that just the males? (sorry don't know much about that stuff). anyone know why vets don't do something like this? am i missing something obvious? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackmagic Posted October 15, 2009 Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 Vets are not trained tattooist? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ranirottie Posted October 15, 2009 Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 I think that is a really good idea x Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gremlin22 Posted October 15, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 Vets are not trained tattooist? i know that but were not talking designs, and they have plenty of experience with needles and the autoclave hygene aspects, and since they are trained surgeons you'd think tattooing would be easier if anything. do greyhounds get tatood by a trained tatooist or do trainers etc do it themselves? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
griff Posted October 15, 2009 Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 i think that is a great idea too and i would happily have any future bitch i have marked on her stomach area to show as speyed, after all they tattoo badgers tummies (i am sure i saw that ona wildlife programme). i wouldn't mind her being marked as long as it was done under anaesthetic at the time of speying ( as i am a big soft eejit and wouldn't like her to feel anything ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gremlin22 Posted October 15, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 i think that is a great idea too and i would happily have any future bitch i have marked on her stomach area to show as speyed, after all they tattoo badgers tummies (i am sure i saw that ona wildlife programme). i wouldn't mind her being marked as long as it was done under anaesthetic at the time of speying ( as i am a big soft eejit and wouldn't like her to feel anything ) totally agree with you there:-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumpole Posted October 15, 2009 Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 our local vets do this on request they tattoo an N in the dogs ear at the time of spaying our local shelter started them off doing it but they will for anyone if requested Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happylittlegreensquirrel Posted October 15, 2009 Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 I think its a great idea , I am looking into tattoos for dogstar dogs but risk of infections make it a bit harder for us. in the UK it could easyily be done and It is done as standard in Australia ( they have a symbol ) WSPA say The application of a tattoo is a painful procedure. WSPA recommends that tattoos are only applied whilst an animal is under general anaesthesia, for surgery, as controlled or supervised by a veterinarian.␣ Tattooing requires puncturing of the skin, which can have infection implications and there is potential for disease transmission between animals. This risk can be minimised by ensuring all equipment and the application site is disinfected. ␣ The animal should be checked initially (and again onr egaining consciousness) for signs of excessive bleeding, and ideally for the next few days for signs of local infection. ␣ The tattoo ink or paste used must be non-toxic. ␣ After a tattoo has been applied, a scab will develop at the site of application where the skin has been punctured, and there is likely to be initial redness of the skin. The site can take up to three weeks to fully heal. This is in paperwork given to organsttaions working in developing countries so I really don't see why it could not be done here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Houndwoman Posted October 15, 2009 Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 I think it is a very good idea as I know how frustrating it is to send a rescue in for spaying only to find she has already been done. It is common practice for feral cats to be identified by having their ears snipped after neutering(I am not suggesting that for dogs btw)! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happylittlegreensquirrel Posted October 15, 2009 Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 ear tipping for street dogs is a common practice overseas as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gremlin22 Posted October 15, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 maybe we could get some campaign going or something, at least for all dogs a vet neuters for a rescue. I know the site is an infection risk, but realistically the spay wound itself is much more of a risk and if that is being monitored after surgery there's no reason why a tattoo can't. I know tatoos hurt, i have them myself and would never suggest they should be done with the dog awake..god only knows what scrawl you would get with a wriggly dog! would it be the BSAVA lot that needed to be approached? i did suggest it to a vet working for a rescue charity once and he laughed at me and told me i was being ridiculous and there was no need for it..but i disagree..but then he was also advocating neutering of dogs from 8 weeks, but thats a different topic.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mole Posted October 16, 2009 Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 This is a great idea! Is it OK if I cross post to other forums please? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cycas Posted October 16, 2009 Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 (edited) My guess would be that a tattoo would push the costs up slightly, and that they already get people put off by the cost of a spay. At my vet when I sign the consent form, I get the option of refusing fluids for the animal during the op and saving £35, and apparently some of their customers do actually do this even though they very strongly suggest that it's not a good move. A while ago I was waiting at the vet and there was someone with a male cat with severe cystitis, unable to urinate at all - and the nurse was in the reception area with the owners, desperately trying to convince them that they absolutely must have something done there and then, even if it was putting the poor beast to sleep, they could not just walk out with him in that state. Thankfully she did manage to talk them into treating him, but they were so reluctant to spend anything on him beyond the basic consult fee. My vet has also sacked a friend of mine who was their relief receptionist: apparently with the credit crunch people are cutting back on vet bills and they were no longer able to pay her. It does mean that I can get an appointment *really* quickly at the mo, but it's rather scary that all these animals are no longer getting the treatment they should have. Edited October 16, 2009 by cycas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happylittlegreensquirrel Posted October 16, 2009 Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 but then he was also advocating neutering of dogs from 8 weeks, but thats a different topic.. Pre Pub spaying is very common in the US , I met a US Vet last week who has performed thousands and thousands of pre pub spays in the US ( your right it is a differant topic but very intresting one ) Cycas I think you are right about costs, its not just the cost of the equipment and ink but also training. In order to make it effective there would have to be a nationwide scheme which would have to be funded by someone ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumpole Posted October 16, 2009 Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 you dont actually need training to tattoo in fact a vast number of people doing the tattooing of registered pit bulls have no formal training in actually tattooing but do have knowledge of hygiene which a vet has already. many bought their equipment on ebay and practise on pork belly as do a large number of tattooists initially. The skill is in the artwork not the use of the gun and the disposable needles available nowadays make the process so much safer After the initial purchase of the equipment and ink the running cost is minimal our shelters vet charge an extra couple of pounds to cover usage. I have always thought it a good idea and have found it to be useful on more than one occasion for example a dog that was chipped by our local shelter to new owners shopwed up miles away in coryns pound it i was rung and immediately because of the N in its ear knew that they had not only chipped the dog but that it was one of their dogs and they took the dog back immediately saving the dog spending time in the pound and another rescue having to find a rescue space or rehome. i would happily back a campaign for this to become routine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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