Rescues And Breeders

[Sherlock Bones]

I'm only going to say it once more. The topic is about whether there is a way forward with rescues and breeders working together, not the rights and wrongs of breeding or rescuing.

 

Keep it on topic, or it goes. Again.

[fee4]

im with Di (Katie bob) on this one.

 

i have been involved with breed shows all my adult life (and obediance)

i am on the committee of Gravesend & medway canine society and i regularly help out at other shows.

 

i also homecheck/transport/donate money/own 2 rescue dogs.

 

i wouldnt have a problem with doing a homecheck for someone like Di-i would sooner that someone did their home work and went for a really good example of the breed then some puppy farmed little soul....if a specific breed is what they want (that is a seperate issue!)

 

the criticism that are being laid at the door of some breeders could easily be laid at the door of some rescues.

 

id like to see the 2 groups move towards each other rather then away.....as in my life time i dont think the problems are going to disappear

 

fee

[Trallwm farm]

If home checks were being provided then I would expect quite a good donation to the sanctuaries participating because its them that will pick up the pieces and the breeder will be making profit.

In fact how about if the dog didnt go back to the breeder then a designated rescue gets the dog and a payment from the breeder.

[JoC]

I'm only going to say it once more. The topic is about whether there is a way forward with rescues and breeders working together, not the rights and wrongs of breeding or rescuing.

 

Keep it on topic, or it goes. Again.

I think the rights and wrongs of breeding IS on topic, it's one of the reasons some rescues are reluctant to work with breeders and vice versa.

[Sherlock Bones]

Not when it degenerates into a row it isn't.

[Trallwm farm]

but but Dee you are rowing with us now

[Sherlock Bones]

only cos me and the other mods have better things to do than play referee Now get talking nicely

[Kaos]

id like to see the 2 groups move towards each other rather then away.....as in my life time i dont think the problems are going to disappear

 

I'd love to see this too....though similarly, unless they come up with something very special within the next few years (ie. a 'living forever pill), I'm never going to see it either.

 

For decades, I've seen the numbers and the size of rescues increase, along with the numbers of animals which pass through them.

So many people work tirelessly, often dedicating their lives to these animals.

The workload is phenomenal, often heartbreaking, and thankless.

Funds are increasingly difficult to obtain, and yet the expectation of high standards of care, accomodation, and the best medical treatment is available for all the animals, along with the flawless conduct of everyone invloved in the rescue, is also increasing.

 

During these decades, the nature of people and our society has changed.

IMO (generally), people are more self centred, have less free time (more work = more £'s), and so are less likely to become valuable volunteers for rescue's.

Of course, there will always be the few who will still dedicate their lives to animals, but realistically, you only have to take a look around the forums and rescues to see how very few of these people there actually are.

You will see the same people trying to be 'superhuman'..... fundraising, organising, pleading for help in one way or another......the same people doing transport runs, fostering, donating, and generally being supportive in whatever way they can.

 

So, the numbers of animals needing assistance are always increasing, but the vital space, funding, and caring people, are not.

In the years to come, what happens when the gap between the two increases to an unmanageable level?

 

In the real world, I believe there will always be people who won't consider offering a rescued animal a home, or meet the rehoming requirements of a rescue.

It doesn't really matter why, the fact is the market for pure bred animals always has been, and (IMO) always will be there.

 

I care deeply about animal welfare, and wherever I can, promote animal rescue.

However, I also feel that it is unrealistic to think that the number of rescues can increase indefinately.

I wish I had a magic wand to make the number of breeders of all animals decrease, the number of caring people increase, along with a money tree, and a perfect world.

 

What I do have, is the desire to chip away at a problem, and try every way I can to help improve it for the future.

We all know that education is one way forward, but I wonder if this alone is going to be sufficient?

Since we can't go on creating endless rescues, my thoughts go to the other end of the problem, to the people who bring the animals into the world.

One way is to continue to lobby whoever necessary for very much stricter breeding controls, and I believe another is to work with the people to causing the problem.

Hence my reason for beginning this topic.

It may well be that it's a dream too far?

But it's why I wanted to hear the opinions of others who care.

Edited April 17, 2007 by Kaos

[Fee]

Hmmm, this is going to sound very one-sided, but I think there is a great deal breeders could do for rescue (and of course some do work very hard for rescue on an individual level), but probably not much rescues or rescue volunteers could or should do for breeders.

 

Breeders, after all, choose to bring a litter of pups into the world and I would see it as totally their responsibility to make sure the pups go to the best possible homes. I don't see why hard-pressed volunteers should get involved in this unless they wish to offer their services as a fundraising exercise.

 

Rescues do not 'choose' to have lots of dogs to rehome, and need all the help they can get from anyone who cares about dog welfare.

 

There are probably common causes such as promoting responsible dog ownership where breeders and rescues could work together more, but I find it hard to see how this could be organised except on an individual level. There are other areas - neutering and docking come to mind - where the attitudes of some (of course not all) breeders are very entrenched and it would be very hard to get past these to find a common ground.

[Trallwm farm]

only cos me and the other mods have better things to do than play referee Now get talking nicely

 

 

Like what then ?

[Jacobean]

Hi Gwyn I'm with you on this one

 

Yes I would help ensure a pup found a good home so would homecheck for a breeder if they needed help.

 

Even a lot of rescues can't work together so there's not much chance of breeders and rescues managing it too well.

 

I know of breeders who homecheck each home offered themselves and give people the 3rd degree too and contracts. I know of others who have turned homes down when they seemed fine but something didn't feel right just as happens in rescue from time to time.

 

We have private individuals on the forums sometimes too that ask for help. Yes they haven't bred the dogs but they still need to put them up for rehoming. I have given them advice and if I was in the area concerned would have homechecked to ensure the dog was in safe hands for the future.

 

There are way too few volunteers. Those that help are spread very thinly and we are slowly wearing them out. People involved on these types of forums have a misconception that we have hundreds of volunteers to call upon for anything we need. Sadly we don't.

 

I have worked at a large company for the last 6 months. I talk about dog rescue to everyone I come across and what I do. I have never had one person offer a donation or their time. I even out and out asked someone if they could help with a transport run. He looked at me as though I was mad. I'm afraid yes we do live in a selfish society where those that care wear themselves out while others don't even notice.

[Trallwm farm]

Hi Gwyn I'm with you on this one

 

Yes I would help ensure a pup found a good home so would homecheck for a breeder if they needed help.

 

Even a lot of rescues can't work together so there's not much chance of breeders and rescues managing it too well.

 

I know of breeders who homecheck each home offered themselves and give people the 3rd degree too and contracts. I know of others who have turned homes down when they seemed fine but something didn't feel right just as happens in rescue from time to time.

 

We have private individuals on the forums sometimes too that ask for help. Yes they haven't bred the dogs but they still need to put them up for rehoming. I have given them advice and if I was in the area concerned would have homechecked to ensure the dog was in safe hands for the future.

 

There are way too few volunteers. Those that help are spread very thinly and we are slowly wearing them out. People involved on these types of forums have a misconception that we have hundreds of volunteers to call upon for anything we need. Sadly we don't.

 

I have worked at a large company for the last 6 months. I talk about dog rescue to everyone I come across and what I do. I have never had one person offer a donation or their time. I even out and out asked someone if they could help with a transport run. He looked at me as though I was mad. I'm afraid yes we do live in a selfish society where those that care wear themselves out while others don't even notice.

 

Very true

[GSDFan]

the criticism that are being laid at the door of some breeders could easily be laid at the door of some rescues.

 

I agree, it can, breeders and rescues need to work together to get rid of the bad and keep the good, whether breeders or rescues

 

If home checks were being provided then I would expect quite a good donation to the sanctuaries participating because its them that will pick up the pieces and the breeder will be making profit.

 

In the first place, if the pups are bred by good responsible breeders then the rescues won't be picking up the pieces. In the second, good breeders don't make big profits and I can't see why people insist on believing they do.

 

In fact how about if the dog didnt go back to the breeder then a designated rescue gets the dog and a payment from the breeder.

 

Do you mean that the breeder shouldn't have the option to take back one of their pups ? If so that is an appalling idea IMO. If I ever bred a litter of puppies, in the unfortunate event of one needing to be re-homed I would want it back. I would not want it to end up in rescue.

 

In the real world, I believe there will always be people who won't consider offering a rescued animal a home, or meet the rehoming requirements of a rescue.

It doesn't really matter why, the fact is the market for pure bred animals always has been, and (IMO) always will be there.

 

I agree Gwyn and it would be better if rescues sent people like that to a good breeder, rather than just saying all breeders are bad. If someone buys a puppy from a good breeder that puppy is much less likely to end up in rescue than if they buy from a puppy farmer or suchlike.

 

What I do have, is the desire to chip away at a problem, and try every way I can to help improve it for the future.

We all know that education is one way forward, but I wonder if this alone is going to be sufficient?

Since we can't go on creating endless rescues, my thoughts go to the other end of the problem, to the people who bring the animals into the world.

One way is to continue to lobby whoever necessary for very much stricter breeding controls, and I believe another is to work with the people to causing the problem.

Hence my reason for beginning this topic.

It may well be that it's a dream too far?

But it's why I wanted to hear the opinions of others who care.

 

 

I think education will help but it will be a slow process. Legislation may help to a certain degree but like a lot of legislation will only really affect law abiding people. Good breeders will abide by changes in the rules, puppy farmers will just cheat. Rescues and breeders working together can help.

 

What won't help is people involved in rescue painting all breeders as evil, money grabbers. Rescuers need to learn to categorise breeders into bad, room for improvement ( and offer help/advise to improve ) and already good.

 

Get more breeders involved in rescue work, that way they will see both sides and may well learn more about how to choose good homes/owners and how to go about keeping track of dogs sold by them.

[EGAR]

I have rehomed a xbred dog to a breeder (one litter so far of health checked etc parents). And I have no doubt she would do a HC for me as I would for her.

 

Also, one of my fosterers takes in solely sick and weak puppies from me as she is a breeder and knows all the ins and outs of the *puppy affairs*, she also raised 1 pup with the bottle, no mean feat considering that it was a GD x. Again, I wouldn't bat an eyelid if she asked me to HC for her. And in both cases I would have NO problem whatsoever to send peeps to them who are looking for these particular breeds.

 

Sarah

[Trallwm farm]

In fact how about if the dog didnt go back to the breeder then a designated rescue gets the dog and a payment from the breeder.

 

 

Do you mean that the breeder shouldn't have the option to take back one of their pups ? If so that is an appalling idea IMO. If I ever bred a litter of puppies, in the unfortunate event of one needing to be re-homed I would want it back. I would not want it to end up in rescue.

 

No thats not what i said or meant but you obviously wanted to believe I did so carry on