DanishPastry Posted August 20, 2008 Report Share Posted August 20, 2008 can someone tell Kathy that she is probably thinking of the basset hound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherlock Bones Posted August 20, 2008 Report Share Posted August 20, 2008 Kathy Anne reliably informs me it's probably the Basset you are thinking of Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
celeste Posted August 20, 2008 Report Share Posted August 20, 2008 I can't understand it either, what shocked me the most was the shepherds being shown, their back legs and a comment something about walking or looking like 'frogs', they looked deformed, their back ends didn't look like legs, the dogs actually looked like they should have their back legs strapped into a cart on wheels to help them walk, it brought me to tears to see that, these people should be prosecuted for cruelty Amanda Couldn't agree more, why have breeders taken, what was a superb working dog, into a freak is beyond me, I know the banana back has it's supporters, but nothing will ever convince me that that extreme angulation is of benefit to the dog and enables the dog to work all day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reds Posted August 20, 2008 Report Share Posted August 20, 2008 I did like the part where the interviewer asked the GSD judge if the winning dog was chosen because they were best able to perform the work they were originally bred for. The judge very tellingly in my opinion didn't confirm that but instead very exactly stated that the dog won because they were closest to breed standard. At least he was honest! The KC came over like rabbits in headlights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mum24dog Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 I did like the part where the interviewer asked the GSD judge if the winning dog was chosen because they were best able to perform the work they were originally bred for. The judge very tellingly in my opinion didn't confirm that but instead very exactly stated that the dog won because they were closest to breed standard. Is that the one who said that dogs that resembled the original working type wouldn't get anywhere in the show ring because they didn't match the breed standard? Ermm - does that make sense to anyone here? Pam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
celeste Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 (edited) Is that the one who said that dogs that resembled the original working type wouldn't get anywhere in the show ring because they didn't match the breed standard?Ermm - does that make sense to anyone here? Pam No it makes no sense at all, but things have changed a lot from what was desirable in a working dog to what is desirable in a beauty pagent, and that goes for a lot of breeds. I wonder if there are any breeds that have stayed the same ? Border Terriers perhaps ? Edited August 21, 2008 by celeste Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtychicken Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 I wonder if there are any breeds that have stayed the same ? Border Terriers perhaps ? Not a bad guess, this is a border terrier back in 192/23: IIRC, the muzzle is a little "boxier" now, but otherwise appears to be fairly similar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
celeste Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 Not a bad guess, this is a border terrier back in 192/23: IIRC, the muzzle is a little "boxier" now, but otherwise appears to be fairly similar I seem to remember Malcom Willis saying if you wanted a healthy pedigree then go for a Border, but even then I've heard of a funny type of epilepsy emerging in Borders Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yantan Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 I seem to remember Malcom Willis saying if you wanted a healthy pedigree then go for a Border, but even then I've heard of a funny type of epilepsy emerging in Borders My George is epileptic and his mum was a full Border terrier tho to be fair he's very mixed breed on his dad's side. An old neighbour of ours whilst I was growing up had an epileptic Border. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cycas Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 I was thinking maybe the Saluki might be a fairly healthy pedigree dog, as I'd not heard anything too terrible about their health, but a Google shows that that breed seems to be prone to heart problems that can cause sudden death at a young age... I suppose all breeds (and non-breeds) can get epilepsy though, just like people. Must be so scary for the animals, it's bad enough for people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
one.eyed.dog Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 Don't think the pointers/gundog types have changed much. I suppose if you get dogs from people who actually work them the way the breed was intended you have a better chance of a decent dog. Does this type of thing go on in the cat world as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ingrid Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 Actually the show pointers are getting noticeably smaller then the working dogs and there are a lot of problems coming in them now. My GSP was bred from 2 of the top lines and as you know had some problems causing aggression which I was told at the time seems to be coming for frequent in them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reds Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 I suppose all breeds (and non-breeds) can get epilepsy though, just like people. Must be so scary for the animals, it's bad enough for people. That's just it, it's not the breed propensity that's the problem as such, it's the line breeding that goes on regardless. If a breeder is informed that one of their offspring (or more of course!) has developed epilepsy then it should be the breeders responsibility to make that common knowledge and to decline any future breeding from that line, and especially to avoid a repeat mating!!! Sadly that doesn't happen as the breeders are not taking responsibility for it, blaming it on 'something' the owners have done. They deny that it's their breeding, try to keep it hidden and carry on regardless. If one puppy out of say 2 litters develops epilepsy then all too many breeders will disregard it and keep on with their desire to breed champion dogs. How many times do you hear, "no-one will want to buy my puppies if....." Brother/sister, Grandparent matings happen in collies intended for the dog sports, it's not just showing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReikiAnge Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 That's just it, it's not the breed propensity that's the problem as such, it's the line breeding that goes on regardless. If a breeder is informed that one of their offspring (or more of course!) has developed epilepsy then it should be the breeders responsibility to make that common knowledge and to decline any future breeding from that line, and especially to avoid a repeat mating!!! Sadly that doesn't happen as the breeders are not taking responsibility for it, blaming it on 'something' the owners have done. They deny that it's their breeding, try to keep it hidden and carry on regardless. If one puppy out of say 2 litters develops epilepsy then all too many breeders will disregard it and keep on with their desire to breed champion dogs. How many times do you hear, "no-one will want to buy my puppies if....." Minnie-Moo's mum was handed into rescue because she'd developed epilepsy and the breeder wasn't going to breed from her anymore (but it then transpired that she was pregnant). I know there's a chance some of the puppies could develop it, but everything crossed they will all be ok. I've also read that epilepsy doesn't have to be hereditary, it could have been caused by a bump on the head when younger and take years to "come out" for example, but I don't know how likely that is. I'm also not sure of how far back up a line the breeder should take things, not an area I've had concern for before tbh, with not buying a puppy from a breeder or being involved in that world. Different condition but you can have a pup with bad hips from parents/grandparents with very good hips, I gather, on occasion, for example - but I'm not sure that would dictate the breeder should stop breeding from the line entirely if it's an isolated case. I also know of dogs that have been affected, as have litter siblings, and the breeder has carried on regardless which is very poor I was really upset seeing the boxer fitting. I have seen people having fits, one of my ex boyfriends had epilepsy and used to have at least one fit a night/morning usually, but his wasn't (for observers anyway) as distressing as watching that poor dog. I don't know if that dog was an "average" epileptic dog or if his fits were really severe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cycas Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 I don't know that there is an average in dogs - there certainly isn't in people. All Mark's mother's family are afflicted with some degree of narcolepsy, his mother developed petit mal seizures (which mostly involve a bad headache, staring into space and a sense of being disconnected) when she was over 50. Yet they were all very surprised when he started getting grand mal seizures (which is more like what the boxer had, very dramatic). I am not sure that you would necessarily notice narcolepsy in a dog, if it was fairly minor, you'd probably just think he was having a nap, he wouldn't be able to explain that he was trapped by sleep and unable to get out of it. You might not even notice petit mal seizures unless you knew what you were looking for. I am told that petit mal is actually more unpleasant for the sufferer than grand mal: grand mal looks awful, but the sufferer is usually well out of it, whereas petit mal is a really horrible feeling that leaves you feeling really sick, but is a lot less noticeable to observers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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