Rspca And Police Raid Midlands Kenne;

[mole]

http://tinyurl.com/rspcaraidmidlandskennel

 

Surely this was nothing to do with welfare issues .... 50 officers

 

Sounds like the dreaded DDA to me IMHO .... mob handed in case there were any dreaded illegal breeds in there.

 

This kennel, which is a pound, helps to get rescue places and homes for many Staff and Rotties which nobody else wants to know about and has a good volunteer base.

 

Would like to hear what experienced DDA people think?

[lester]

http://tinyurl.com/r...dmidlandskennel

 

Surely this was nothing to do with welfare issues .... 50 officers

 

Sounds like the dreaded DDA to me IMHO .... mob handed in case there were any dreaded illegal breeds in there.

 

This kennel, which is a pound, helps to get rescue places and homes for many Staff and Rotties which nobody else wants to know about and has a good volunteer base.

 

Would like to hear what experienced DDA people think?

 

This is the RSPCA running its own agenda for publicity purposes m having found out ho weasy it is to manipulate the boys in blue. If Rosedene should be closed so many others should watchout!

They have to get back into the publici eye becausue of the need for funds and so many messups lately, especially locally a forthcoming dog ring case. When it hits the press ---wow.

[safneo]

I am APPALLED by the behaviour of the RSPCA! WTF did they need 50 officers for? Any animal, canine or human would have s*** themselves and been defensive with that mob wading in! RIP Diesel, Stocking and Clarke. I will never give them a penny!! It does smell of DDA. I wonder what has been happening at Sunnyside? Any bullbreeds gone missing?

Edited January 24, 2010 by safneo

[BillyMalc]

RSPCA: Royal Society for the Persecution and Culling of Animals - nuff said! :angry: :angry:

[Lizzie]

RSPCA: Royal Society for the Persecution and Culling of Animals - nuff said! :angry: :angry:

 

 

Well said Billy!

 

I'm bloody apalled by the way the RSPCA have gone about this.

[Ian]

Whether the RSPCA have handled this well is debatable - I adopted Joyce from Rosedene and so know first hand what the volunteers (lots) and staff (naff all) there did in terms of getting me to go & meet her, asking after her for the rest of her life etc. I therefore still followed their website, exchange the occasional email etc & personally saw a photo of Diesel in the last week or so, volunteer demonstrating his far from "unhandleable" nature by taking a biscuit out of Diesels teeth in his own. This isn't however anything to do with the D.D.A. in my opinion. Note the comment on Wombles departure - yes he was a Rosedene dog too. Facilites at Rosedene were like many pounds basic - but from what I've seen no better & no worse than many others. As Lester says if they deserve to be closed there are lots of others who ought to follow suit. It saddens me that with 3 dogs already dead, some very caring volunteers upset, angry and concerned for the fate of the dogs they had done their best to help in difficult circumstances this story appears to be starting to be used as a "political football" (I don't just mean here). Local press articles http://www.birminghammail.net/news/top-stories/2010/01/23/walsall-boarding-kennels-shut-down-after-rspca-raid-97319-25668605/ http://www.expressandstar.com/2010/01/23/animals-destroyed-as-kennels-are-shut/ <BR><BR><BR>Wombles thread<BR><A href="http://www.therefuge.org.uk/forums/index.php?showtopic=49694">http://www.therefuge.org.uk/forums/index.php?showtopic=49694</A>

Edited January 24, 2010 by Ian

[Ian]

Trying to add last link messed up the first two & the editing (on my version of IE?) & "time out" on this board is hopeless

 

Local press

http://www.birminghammail.net/news/top-stories/2010/01/23/walsall-boarding-kennels-shut-down-after-rspca-raid-97319-25668605/

 

http://www.expressandstar.com/2010/01/23/animals-destroyed-as-kennels-are-shut/

 

 

Wombles thread

http://www.therefuge.org.uk/forums/index.php?showtopic=49694

[Rumpole]

i really have no idea whats gone on , though i dont think its dda related, and from the reports its sounding like conditions under animal welfare act. but they are licensed and so local authority bears a lot of the responsibility particularly as the kennels have the stray contract.

[Ian]

I agree about the Council being culpable, though I believe the Dog Wardens may have been contracted rather than Council employees & I wouldn't be surprised if they try & pass the buck to them & the kennels.

 

Poundies up & down this country probably deserve better protection than they are getting

[Helly]

Dog wardens dont actually have any say in kennel conditions. Then can come in, have a good nosey round and ask questions. They have no powers, other than to bring environmental health in, who do have the power to close kennels down.

 

In St Helens, all kennels are inspected at least twice a year. The inspectors have to power to shut down, or give a restricted licence pending work done/conditions improved etc. Considering all kennels across the whole of the UK are governed by the model licence conditions, its a wonder how places can vary so much.

 

I know its a very unpopular view, but for the sake of all dogs, I would like to see all rescues come in line with kennel conditions, or at least match some of them. I know that would make life very difficult for smaller rescues but rescued animals need some form of protection.

[Ian]

Dog wardens dont actually have any say in kennel conditions. Then can come in, have a good nosey round and ask questions. They have no powers, other than to bring environmental health in, who do have the power to close kennels down.

 

In St Helens, all kennels are inspected at least twice a year. The inspectors have to power to shut down, or give a restricted licence pending work done/conditions improved etc. Considering all kennels across the whole of the UK are governed by the model licence conditions, its a wonder how places can vary so much.

 

I know its a very unpopular view, but for the sake of all dogs, I would like to see all rescues come in line with kennel conditions, or at least match some of them. I know that would make life very difficult for smaller rescues but rescued animals need some form of protection.

 

In Hull I believe the Dog Wardens actually come under the environment Dept (are Council employees) & are also responsible for licensing. Latest link I could find to check this is still current is old but here http://www.hullcc.gov.uk/pls/portal/docs/PAGE/HOME/COUNCIL%20GOVERNMENT%20AND%20DEMOCRACY/COMMITTEES%20AND%20MEETINGS/OVERVIEW_SCRUTINY/SCRUTINY%20PUBLISHED%20REPORTS/1DOGWARDENS%20.PDF

 

Rosedenes situation was probably also going to be complicated by the fact that whilst I'd assume they are licensed as a kennels by Walsall Council (who I believe use BDH for strays) they are contracted for strays by the nearby Sandwell & Dudley Councils - serving more than one "master" rarely works well in my opinion.

 

I wasn't specifically aware that was a widely unpopular view to be honest (though I think I can imagine the line of argument from some) but I've questioned before the need for more regulation myself - rescues, trainers, behaviourists & breeders alike - & I think you're basically right there (though I've been in some boarding kennels I thought questionable too) I can see no justification whatsoever for a stray or rescued dog being entitled to less protection than a boarding kenneled / "identified owners" dog is

 

I also think there should be greater clarity between what is a rescue and what is a pound - at the moment we have pounds calling themselves rescues too & adoption agreements / disclaimers that to me utterly defy simultaneous claims of dogs having been given the very best veterinary care whilst there.

[cycas]

I assume there must have been some fairly concrete reason behind this, but the methods do seem rather excessive, unless there is something more going on - 50 people in a sudden raid? Three dogs put to sleep after what can only have been at most an hour or so's assessment?

 

When I read that I initially assumed that the dogs put to sleep must have been in poor condition or injured or something, but looking at the details posted by the Rosedene volunteers on Facebook, it appears that they were healthy young dogs, two rotties and what looks to my uninformed eye like a very pittbully staffy cross and all of them had been there a while interacting with the volunteers apparently without biting anyone...

 

If Rosedene lacked the resources to care for 60-odd dogs, why not require them to cut down to 30 over time, or even to close within 3 months or something? Why did it need 50 people and the whole place closed in a day? Why not at least allow the dogs normal walkers to bring them from the kennels, given that they were apparently available to do so as part of the normal daily routine?

 

I would very much like to see the RSPCA statement on this one.

Edited January 25, 2010 by cycas

[Helly]

Our dog wardens come under the 'environmental health' banner too, but dont have the powers of the inspecters. All 4 of ours are quite nice though and I would imagine would have the sense to poke about, make suggestions and strongly hint of a problem before they waded in with action.

 

When I was buying this kennels I went to view a lot of kennels on the market, and to some owners, a pound contract was purely a ' £ ' contract. They were very matter of fact of how much a day these dogs brought in, how you didnt have to worry about warm bedding or the right food, especially the older ones as they would be dead in a week anyway. The stray dogs had no rights and were seen literally as a 'disposble' income

 

The view of bringing all rescues into line with kennels is very unpopular with many smaller rescues, as they just dont have the kind of funds needed to bring them up to standard. Some do a fanstastic job still, and the care and attention far outweighs the matter of whether the kennels is made of wood or galvanised steel. Some really mean well but overstretch themselves and some just want to shunt dogs in and out without a giving a toss.

[Ian]

I think this is about the nearest there is to a public statement so far Victoria

 

http://www.expressandstar.com/2010/01/23/animals-destroyed-as-kennels-are-shut/

 

Personally I would suspect the place could have done with some improvement - as I said it was an old / basic site when I was there in Dec' 2006 - but I've been in other pounds & rescues / boarding kennels that are likewise. Are there any really excellent pounds out there? Although I've never met them I doubt the owner is a true dog lover, based on the end of the conversation I heard on the phone when I collected Joyce (as I said in emails at the time, when updating those who'd helped Joyce find her way here to us) the employee gave him the no. of dogs "sold" that day & there was no apparent reaction / correction to that nor going on to name which dogs had been rehomed etc)

 

From what has been said by various people in various places ("cleaner", volunteers etc from Rosedene) it's claimed that as well as the Council the RSPCA have seen the place in the last year & with little change since, one person even claims their ("new") dog unwanted by the RSPCA was . Some allegations (frozen or broken water pipes,leaving them with one working tap, lack of heating) have been answered with explanation of a fault in the street pipes affecting the whole road that day & that with the heating struggling to cope more was brought in.

 

The dogs had been there ranging from 5 Jan, 17th December & 26th October, I understand walked & handled by various volunteers regularly during that time. Some seized dogs were already reserved to other rescues so it shouldn't have been difficult to prevent further incoming dogs & reduce numbers over the last few weeks at least.

 

 

 

Di, Yes, although it's never been said to me as openly as that I think I may have met some "£" people myself , & of course there have been several rescues publicly condemned / closed down hence partly why I've come to think improved regulation is the only answer myself.

 

I can sort of see the problem / argument in terms of being able to help the same numbers - a similar argument being used re neutering, chipping, even worming & vacinations etc - but, whether it gets used as the people giving it believe or not, I reckon there is an awful lot of money out there (with rescues of all sizes) that could be helping animals & isn't right now.

 

 

[cycas]

I've seen that, but really it's just a report by a journalist of something that an RSPCA spokesperson may or may not have said. We don't know whether she has been reported accurately, or what her answer to the question of why this approach was taken would have been, so it's hard to judge...

 

I can't believe Rosedene was a model kennels, but I'm really hoping the RSPCA will explain why it was chosen for a raid with 50 officers and a vet when puppy farms and poor pet shops, greyhound kennels seem to go on year after year without really being noticed. There must be some reason, even if it's inaccurate or based on dodgy info.