alisonsophieb Posted August 2, 2008 Report Share Posted August 2, 2008 (edited) I don't believe it's a black and white issue either. I think it depends on each individual case. A bad childhood can and does affect a person their whole life. My dad was "given up" at 6 months. He was never adopted, left the boys home at 18 years and went straight into the army for 2 reasons I suppose, most importantly he had no where else to go and maybe after so many years of a strict regimental upbringing it seemed the natural thing to do. He will be 68 this year. He has never known the reason behind why he was given up and as far as he knows his "parents" have never tried to find him. He never talks about his past. I am the only child, I know he loves me more than life it's self but has never shown me emotionally, if that makes sense, I don't think he knows how to. My dad has made a good life for himself worked hard always provided well for me and my mum and still does, daddy's little girl and I'm 36. He has never used his upbringing as a reason to break the law or take drugs. Sorry I watch to much Jeremy Kyle. But I do believe he has been affected deeply and I can't really put my finger on it to explain why. I have never wanted children and thankfully never been in a position to have to make a decision regarding a pregnancy, but I do know I would not have been able to give a child up for adoption because of my dad and with him being such a private person I would never know how that would have affected him. Equally if I had needed to make a choice regarding abortion I would never have told him. I don't know difficult to explain but nobody wanted him and then nobody wanted his grandchild, surely that would hurt. Edited to say - over the years I have often wondered if I should have wanted/had children for my dad. He would be the best grand dad in the world. But of course that isn’t a good reason to have a child. But my mum did. She wouldn’t have had me if it wasn’t for my dad wanting what my mum has always said “something of his ownâ€. sorry off the subject maybe that’s another thread “ is it right to have a child because a person you love dearly wants oneâ€. Edited August 2, 2008 by alisonsophieb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kathyw Posted August 2, 2008 Report Share Posted August 2, 2008 I know of someone who did just that. Well I know her mother. This woman was married and together they run a very successful business. He wanted a baby - she didn't but she had one anyway. Shame on her - she went back to work when the child was two weeks old and her Mum has brought the child up. He goes home at weekends - he is 6 years old. One of my close friends was over the moon to be pregnant and revelled in her pregnancy - the baby was born and my friend seemed happy - but I knew something was wrong and was frightened to ask in case it was something with the baby. My friend had expected to feel this rush of overwhelming love when they gave her the baby - she didn't feel anything at all except shame. She couldn't understand why this much wanted child aroused no feelings in her at all. She wouldn't talk to the nurses or doctors about it as she felt she was un-natural. The love came out after a few weeks and then she was the besotted Mum we all thought she would be. When she was expecting her second child she feared the same and started to ask questions and found out that it is a very common occurance, can last for months and is rarely just the result of a difficult birth (my mate said she coughed and the baby almost popped out). So it is quite possible that some of the Mum's who gave their babies up went through similar, not that I mean that is why they gave their babies up. That would have already been decided. A very dear friend of mine told me her secret one night - 15 years into the friendship - we had a takeaway and were swapping stories. She had a child, a daughter and had given the baby up for adoption. She had nursed the baby for six weeks prior to the adoption and then handed her child over to the nurses. My friend was alone in a Catholic Mother and Baby home. She had been taken there by her own mother. She was told by her parents that she could have the baby It was the family secret shame. They never spoke of it ever and to this day my friends Mum doesn't know that I know about the baby. She is 93. My friend sobbed for hours, all the years of pent up feelings came pouring out - she had never spoken of her child and held all those feelings in. She went on to become very successful in her life - she never had another child. She told me that every morning she said 'Good morning xxxxxx' to her child and every night she said 'nite nite God Bless xxxxxx' and on the child's birthday (funnily enough same day as my birthday and we never knew each other then) she wished her child a happy birthday. she said she knew she would never get over the loss of her child but knew that the child would have gone to a very good home, she said she couldn't bear to think otherwise. I offered to start a search for her daughter (on the online boards) but only got so far as my friend needed to do the rest but she said no, I gave her up - I cannot lookm for her now. If she looks for me and finds me then my life will be happy again but if she chooses not to then so be it. My heart truly broke. I saw a strong, controlled woman weep pityfully for hours - crying the tears that were denied her for over 20 years. We constantly talked of her child after that and I know she found it healing in a small way to be able to talk about her beloved daughter. This was in the early 60's and in those days things were very different to how they are today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alisonsophieb Posted August 2, 2008 Report Share Posted August 2, 2008 Sorry again but really off the subject now but not that I want to get into religion but my step daughters have been here this week, 10 and 14. Their mother is Catholic when it suits and the girls go to catholic schools. The other night the eldest came down to me and wanted a girlie chat or should I say tampax talk. Her biggest concern is for her hyman (sp) splitting/breaking or what ever the correct term is. She has never seen a tampax only boxes on the shelf in the supermarket. She is a very intelligent girl but very naive, I suppose because of her upbringing. I think we all know what she has been told at school about birth control, if it has ever been mentioned. We sat chatting for some time about all different things, she had a lot of questions. Is it not better that she is well informed in the hope that the is never a need for an abortion or adoption rather than “nuns†teaching them to fear their bodies and in 2008 sex before marriage is a sin. Not that I am of course saying she is or should be having sex but unfortunately girls of her age are and if she decides she’s ready she should have all the facts. The above post - child born in the 60’s. I was astounded by the “Magdalene sisters.†(sp?) and if I remember correctly the last laundry’s were closed in the early 70’s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nouggatti Posted August 2, 2008 Report Share Posted August 2, 2008 The last Magdelene laundry closed in the late eighties/early nineties in Ireland Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanishPastry Posted August 2, 2008 Report Share Posted August 2, 2008 what is a Magdalene laundry? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happylittlegreensquirrel Posted August 2, 2008 Report Share Posted August 2, 2008 what is a Magdalene laundry? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magdalen_Asylum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alisonsophieb Posted August 2, 2008 Report Share Posted August 2, 2008 The last Magdelene laundry closed in the late eighties/early nineties in Ireland Really OMG for such places to exist at any time doesn’t bare thinking about but early 90’s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReikiAnge Posted August 2, 2008 Report Share Posted August 2, 2008 Really OMG for such places to exist at any time doesn't bare thinking about but early 90's. Sam's link said the last one closed in Ireland in 1996 Sounds as though it started off with good intention and ended up being something very different Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kathyw Posted August 2, 2008 Report Share Posted August 2, 2008 My friend was sent to a mother and baby home in Liverpool - it wasn't a laundry - she did no work there just waited for her baby to come. But she was not looked upon kindly because of her situation. she was given a place there because they arranged the adoption. Had she wanted to keep the baby she would not have been allowed to go there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReikiAnge Posted August 2, 2008 Report Share Posted August 2, 2008 My friend was sent to a mother and baby home in Liverpool - it wasn't a laundry - she did no work there just waited for her baby to come. But she was not looked upon kindly because of her situation. she was given a place there because they arranged the adoption.Had she wanted to keep the baby she would not have been allowed to go there. I'm glad things have changed. A few years ago - I guess about six years plus now, I met a young girl at a bus stop when the bus failed to turn up. I think she was about 16. I ended up getting a taxi to work in the end and invited her to share and she was telling me she had a baby - she was living in a house for young single mothers where they got support, education (in child care) and I think care for their babies while they went into college and she was looking at going to college to do a course of some sort. It seemed a really positive idea and must make a huge difference for those young girls who don't have support at home for whatever reason. I really feel for those that weren't able to make such decisions when they were young single mums Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanishPastry Posted August 2, 2008 Report Share Posted August 2, 2008 Sam's link said the last one closed in Ireland in 1996 Sounds as though it started off with good intention and ended up being something very different 1996!! cannot find a polite way to say what I want about religion right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nouggatti Posted August 3, 2008 Report Share Posted August 3, 2008 Magdelene Sisters The link above gives details of a movie about the Magdelene Laundries, it's not particularly pleasant viewing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owl Posted August 3, 2008 Report Share Posted August 3, 2008 I read a book by a former Magdalene inmate, who had a child while resident there. This was not uncommon, and the babies were given up for adoption in return for a substantial donation to the convent. Gentlemen of good reputation were permitted to spend time alone with the girls in order to exhort them to repentance, hence the babies. Certainly when I was in my twenties, it was very difficult for a single mother to keep her baby simply because it was well-nigh impossible to find housing. Most rented accommodation was "no children" even if you were married. The authorities were not above sectioning a girl because she refused to give her baby up, or having her declared an unfit mother. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happylittlegreensquirrel Posted August 3, 2008 Report Share Posted August 3, 2008 In the 70s in Ireland ( and it may well have been later ) if a child was born to a single mother and had no fathers name on the birth certificate the child was not eligible for adoption and was placed in a "home" with the Nuns , Its very different back home now , one of my cousins in Ireland had a child out of wedlock and with no partner ( he had done a bunk ) and it was no scandal ( maybe a bit of gossip but no scandel ) However just one generation earlier a women in the same position as my cousin had to take the option of the nuns ( and travel to a home in the country to have the baby in secret ) or if she was lucky maybe travel to the UK and place the child for adoption with a catholic agency in the UK ( who could/would place a "bastard" child with a new family ) it really is in living memory ( both in the UK and Eire ) that women had to give up babies no if ands or buts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparkle Posted August 4, 2008 Report Share Posted August 4, 2008 I'd like to think that the kids will all grow up having had a happy childhood but am wondering whether or not their birth will affect them irrepective of how good their adoptive families were. I mean what if they grow up feeling this deep rooted sense of rejection? I wouldn 't know although I have some experience of it - I was brought up with a biological mother who has issues surrounding her own importance and my irrelevance and have no doubt her behaviour damaged me. I also faced a lot of rejection throughout my life from her if I did things she disagreed with. My own daughter faces frequent rejection from her 'sperm donor' and I see that damaging her regularly. But I can't help going from thinking giving up at birth is either a very selfish or very brave act. As I have already posted I have a fantastic family and had a lovely childhood but your post really struck a cord with me, it is so hard to explain to people how it effects you, especially when you are lucky and are adopted by the right people, they don't understand how you can still be so terrified of rejection I am convinced that everyone important in my life will eventually recognise that I am not worth loving and will leave me, it is probably why I always ended relationships, get in first and leave them before they leave you. I know it is stupid and I know I am loved, just back from a fantastic weekend with the majority of my family at my cousin's wedding, we all get on brilliantly and love each other, but I can't explain why I feel it. When I was younger about twice a year I would have a weekend of bawling my eyes out trying to understand how she (my birth mother) could have carried me for 9 months and not loved me enough to keep me, most of the time I am so thankful that she did give me up, my family is the best and I wouldn't be without them, but sometimes it just hurts so much that I can't explain it I am not looking for sympathy or hugs lovely Fugees just saying that even though I am happy and love my family it does still effect you, having said that I would much rather be a part of my family than my birth mother keeping me, I know that sounds like a contradiction, but even though being adopted has effected me, I would much rather have the odd doubt than not have my family Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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