Unassisted Births

[krusewalker]

There is nothing wrong with telling stories as long as no names are being named, Donna. It is quite normal for people do talk about their personal experiences here, wheter it is animal welfare or all other aspects of life. Naming names, towns or posting pictues would be illegal yes, but just saying "I had this case" is not violating anyones rights, surely?

No one is saying that women have no choise, there are lots of different ways of doing things "right", and as long as womens choise is not compromising the health or safety of the child, then anyone is free to parent as they please, as I understand it?

 

Personally I would think that chosing to give birth with no assistance would be foolish, but I am all for homebirths with midwifes present to help should anything go wrong.

[nouggatti]

Although a lot of miles from Jules as a foster mum I saw one woman do the same, not inform gps etc of her pregnancy and had a unasisted birth, this woman also had four children took away from her for severe neglect before this birth, but her stance was she will carry on having babies until they get fed up of taking them off her or dont notice the new baby

 

There is a world of difference between having a well planned home birth with everything in place incase something does go wrong ie midwifes in attendance etc to a unassisted birth

 

Same here, I know of a case of a baby taken from his mum as she was an alcoholic and unable to care for him either during or after her pregnancy, he suffers from foetal alcohol syndrome as a result of the lack of care when in utero

 

I do accept of course that the vast majority of mothers want the very best for their babies both pre and post birth, and take all the care they can, but there are the minority out there who do not and cause pain and suffering, sometimes for years to their children as a result of that.

 

Personally I'd love to have a home birth or a birthing pool, but am too old at this stage if I ever do have children

ETA: I'm not a friend of Jules, Donna, have never met her, or even "spoken" to her, apart from on here, don't think I've ever even pmed her And what Anne, and Helly have said is correct, there is no breach on Jules part due to her posting.

Edited July 14, 2008 by nouggatti

[DanishPastry]

FFS what is the problem with this website, I HAD logged in as me

 

 

Donna the "Krusewalker" post was from me I am also not really 100% sure what you are getting so upset about?

Edited July 14, 2008 by DanishPastry

[cocoa]

and what happens to the girl sat there thinking there's no one to trusted ?

 

and as i am sure that i was told i should not be talking about the kids i was looking after or there cases

I can't see how a working in this friend could do the same!

 

there are 2 sides the mother has rights

[snow]

 

I think some posts have been misunderstood, I am also not very happy with strong emotive words being thrown about - please take deep breaths (ooo thats kinda ironic given the topic ) and back slowly away from the big bad snowy person with the pointy stick ....

[Helly]

and what happens to the girl sat there thinking there's no one to trusted ?

 

and as i am sure that i was told i should not be talking about the kids i was looking after or there cases

I can't see how a working in this friend could do the same!

 

there are 2 sides the mother has rights

 

 

but Donna, the bit you are missing is that no where in this thread has Jules given any clue as to the identity of the mother, the where about, the exact details of what went on, or when it took place so how can she be divulging information that is sensative or explicit?

 

All I am reading is Jules giving very vague examples of why unassisted births are not always best for baby being born. Like others, im not understanding which bit of that you are finding offensive or wrong.

[ReikiAnge]

I think nervous Mums to be need not worry Ange I'm sure they'd be very gentle with you,many women are very scared.It is the unknown and that is always frightening and you are putting yourself and your unborn child at the mercy of someone else.You get to look round everywhere which I think makes a lot of women feel more relaxed about it all.

 

 

Ange, plenty of ladies have homebirths with their first babies. If there are no complications during the pregnancy there should be no problems. The community midwives where I live love homebirths, every one I met was so positive and they were so excited in the days leading up to Georgias birth, each one wanting to be here with us

 

Thanks both of you

[fee4]

i can see no breech of confidentiality in this thread (i say that with my professional head on).

 

frankly-if i had had kids i would have prefered the Doris Day vesion of childbirth.

she tells Rock Hudson there is about to be a wonderful event-cut to pristine bed with Doris holding clean new born-then cut to Doris looking immaculate with a blonde 4 year old.

Bliss

 

However: women do die in childbirth. evidence suggests that the most prefered options are midwife led-the woman has greater contol regarding the level of intervention/support. But should it all go wrong-medical assistance is on hand straight away.

i cant personally see why you would risk yourself & your child whn you dont have to.

 

fee

[Rileyroo]

Going back to the unassisted births - which was primarily about women in the USA.

A friend of mine on another forum had this to say - she lives in the States, and has recently had her first child:

 

"Over here they call it "Unassisted Childbirth" it's quite a big thing among the less mainstream parents. Take a look on the mothering.com forums, they have a whole section for it.

 

It largely is a reaction to the birth culture over here - hospitals get you in, shove an epidural in your back, lie you on your back, pump you full of pitocin and then either give you an episiotomy and ventouse the baby out or give you a c-section for failure to progress...

 

Midwives attending homebirths can be sued and imprisoned in some states. If you want anything other than a highly medicalised birth then unassisted may seem the only way to go for some women in some areas.

 

Some states also have laws that you can't give birth at home if you've previously had a c-section. My best chance of avoiding another c-section for a subsequent birth would be to labor and deliver at home, but my state makes it illegal for any midwife to deal with a VBAC at home. So I'll have to go to hospital, and more than likely will end up being chopped up again (bitter, moi?!). Unassisted childbirth would be a way for a VBAC Mum to retain control over her birth and avoid a c-section again.

 

And there is no free health care in many states if you have no insurance. Having a baby is ridiculously expensive. My hospital stay was $5,000. The doctors who looked at S for 20 mins after she was born charged us $3,000. It goes on and on. If you have no insurance you still get billed. You only get medicaid if you live literally in a hostel, and even then you get sub-par medical care.

 

I can see both sides of it. I think that birth is not something to be frightened of, but I think it important to have an experienced person present.

 

As for the prenatal care, I was going to have no scans myself. I don't think they are very helpful, they can create problems, and sometimes I think it's better to leave things to nature and just trust your body. I ended up with a scan which showed a possible problem, which led to more scans, which led to a forced hospital birth, which led to a c-section. I often wonder what would have happened if my totally healthy baby had never been scanned - would she have been born into my arms at home? Or would I have regretted it? Who knows.

 

I'd be interested to see that programme - I hope it isn't an alarmist piece full of miserable stories, some of the UC birth stories I've read have been lovely and very touching in their simplicity and purity.."

 

 

Like Ange said earlier, I too am very anxious in hospitals (despite - or perhaps because of - having worked in them for the last 15 years) and always intended that, had I had children, I would do everything possible to have a home birth. They are statistically safer than hospital births, they do not put your babies life in any more danger than being in a hospital and absolutely an option for a first time mum. I have 4 friends who've all had home births as first-timers.

[mooandboo]

I was born at home, as was my brother with no complications whatsoever (44 and 47 years ago but with midwife present) but we are 3rd and 2nd children respectively.

 

If I had another I would do everything in my power to have a home birth but wouldn't consider it without a midwife in attendance.

 

I do feel that with Ceri's birth there was far too much interference but as others have said, the most important thing is that he was delivered safe and healthy

 

I wish that I'd gone to the hospital where my pre natal midwives worked but it didn't have a very good reputaton so I opted for another some miles away with staff I'd never met before (who were mostly wonderful apart from the one I ended up in the delivery room with )

[Happylittlegreensquirrel]

, the most important thing is that he was delivered safe and healthy

 

and that really sums it up for me ,

 

I gave birth in a hospital and yes it was a tad more restricted than I would have ideally liked ( not able to walk around and on a monitor ) but at the end of the 48 hours labour I had my daughter and thats all that mattered ( and the staff were wonderful even if they would not let me off the bed ! ) they were doing their job which was to help me deliver a healthy baby and they succeeded 100%.

 

I was a labouring woman for 48 hours of my life and I be will be a mother ( hopefully ) for the rest of my life

 

being a mother is a the bit I spend all focus time and energy on , giving birth was just the start of our journey together

 

Personally I would not wish to have a child on my own , I valued the experience of the professional staff with me and the support from my birthing partners.

[cocoa]

I don't think my point is clear

 

 

you all had the right to pick what you want if it did not work out well thing don't

remember my one was born at 27 weeks

 

but you had rights to start with, how would you feel if that was taken away ?

 

what you like or don't like think is a mad idea all ok

 

but your rights to start with? your right

 

the mother took on some thing i would not, but i still feel they have that right.

[lazydaisy]

I read an article in the Guardian last week about obstricticians (sp) who choose to have cesarians because they know what the risks are!! That certainly does not give someone about to have a baby much confidence. I think home births with a midwife present are a good idea if you do not have any risk factors caused by your health. I had both mine in hospital, first was 14 days late and induced, which led to the whole range of interventions (and had a long lasting effect on me), second child 10 days late and induced, but thankfully after the induction I did it with out an epidural and the birth was a lot better.

[cocoa]

i can see no breech of confidentiality in this thread (i say that with my professional head on).

 

 

sorry so the right to stand up for your self ?

if some one if not here to give there side ?

 

I think she has. that girl should not have her story! all over the net,

we don't know her size we have one side which could be right but we don't know that.

 

sorry but i don't feel at all.

[Helly]

I don't think my point is clear

 

 

you all had the right to pick what you want if it did not work out well thing don't

remember my one was born at 27 weeks

 

but you had rights to start with, how would you feel if that was taken away ?

 

what you like or don't like think is a mad idea all ok

 

but your rights to start with? your right

 

the mother took on some thing i would not, but i still feel they have that right.

 

I really do get your point Donna, and yes everyone has rights, but surely that should include the baby about to be born. I dont think anyone here is disputing the right to have a baby at home, with someone about who has medical training to deal with any problem or complication, or someone who has popped out several kids with no problems and their health checks through pregnancy says fine go for it. I think the dispute here is going it totally alone. If baby is born flat, not breathing, cord round its neck, breech (all guesses as ive never had kids but watched programs on it) then what are the chances of babys survival if mum doesnt know what to do?

 

what if mum has already had kids removed for abuse, neglect or worse, and is secretly giving birth so as not to have this one taken away. When baby is in A+E with broken bones and the papers are screaming where were social services, is that surely not too late?

 

I support every mothers right to have her baby where ever she so wants, as long as the people who spent years learning their stuff are happy that the baby and mother are not at any risk. I think to go ahead when the risks are high is irresponsible to both baby and mother.