Dogs On Lead Signs

[cycas]

Our most local popular dog walking area is Kit Hill country park. This is a large area of ex-mining land given to the people of Cornwall by the Duke of Cornwall and administered by Cornwall county council. It's a very popular dog walking area, and very rarely do you see anyone with an onlead dog there, as there is loads of space, plenty of different routes around it for those with less social dogs, and no sheep. The vast majority of people walking there outside of peak holiday times are dogwalkers.

 

Today I noticed that the new 'education' signs that have been put up at the car parks have in small print in one corner 'dogs are welcome but must be kept on the lead from 1st March to 31st July to protect nesting birds.'

 

Needless to say, nobody had their dogs on lead, and everyone I spoke to about this was very shocked at this sudden change. Even the park wardens have dogs, and they are always offlead too!

 

We will be opposing this. The hill is surrounded by privately owned agricultural land which is not intensively farmed or accessible to the public and their dogs: there is plenty of space that is available to birds, not so much available to people with their dogs.

 

A friend of mine is researching contacts at the council this weekend. We are hoping that the wording of the signs is a mistake but if it isn't, the council have got a fight on their hands....

 

Anyone got any advice or resources to recommend?

[Happylittlegreensquirrel]

do you have a local species of birds that nest on the ground then ? if not I can't see how keeping dogs on leads is going to impact the birds

[cycas]

There are quite a lot of ground nesting birds across much of the UK - we have golden plover, lapwings, and skylarks.

 

However, these birds have survived many years of offlead dog activity on the hill, and are unlikely to be nesting on the paths and most accessible areas anyway. As I mentioned, the area is surrounded by grazing land to which there is no dog access, and certainly when I see the lapwings and golden plovers, those are generally the areas they seem to settle in anyway.

 

Dogs do almost certainly disrupt the bird life (though in fact, the study that is most often cited in support of this is a study that was carried out in Australia, where they have dingos! Quite often the citation doesn't even mention that the study wasn't carried out on a UK ecosystem, which irritates me considerably. )

 

However, it's not as though this is something that has suddenly changed, and you can't just remove all offlead dog walking space for 5 months across the whole area, that's wholly disproportionate.

[Ian]

It annoys me that there are publicly funded fields around here which I can't use (to exercise dogs but have no other use for) but there is nowhere set aside for dogs to use & not the kids - we have to go somewhere!

 

Despite that however, unfortunately they probably can do it if they've brought in one of these infernal "dog control orders" without you realising / seeing the "consultation" (not that they appear to listen) Some examples from that area of the world

 

http://www.cornwall.gov.uk/Default.aspx?page=17463

 

http://www.eastdevon.gov.uk/dog_wardens.htm

 

Dogs Trust comment / suggestions

http://www.dogstrust.org.uk/az/d/dogcontrolorders/default.aspx

[lester]

Er what birds? I know the area well but many years ago so these must be recent immigrants that the twitchers havent heard about.

You can get your own signs these days that allow the people/community /landusers to overturn posters and instructions made by council. They cost around £18 per 300 and are weatherproof full colour vinyl and your own choice of artwork /wording , on ebay .

Or you can get ready made ones from British Bulldog that say "loose dog walk" or " free dog area" but you may have to send details of the walk.

[blackmagic]

This is the CROW act

 

The CROW Act

 

The CROW Act is not a licence to wander anywhere and the term right to roam may be something of a misnomer. The right only applies to areas which have been specifically designated as open land under the CROW Act.

 

The extent of access to the countryside can be ascertained using specially marked Explorer maps which are available from Ordnance Survey. Explorer maps show the areas designated as access land marked with a right to roam symbol. The distinctive symbol, which depicts a figure walking across hills within a magenta coloured circle, also appears on physical features on the ground such as posts and boundary fences. Further information on the extent of designated countryside access land can also be obtained at the Countryside Access webpage.

 

In addition to the restrictions on where to walk, ramblers should be aware that there are also a number of activities which are prohibited on designated access land. The Ramblers' Association website contains a comprehensive list of proscribed activities which include:

 

* camping

* driving or riding a vehicle

* hunting, shooting or fishing.

 

Dogs must be kept on a short lead of no more than two metres during the main breeding season for ground nesting birds (1 March to 31 July). Restrictions may also apply at local level, for example, for conservation purposes.

 

Read more at Suite101: Countryside Access Walks in England and Wales: How To Find Open Access Land When Walking in Wales and England http://walking-tours.suite101.com/article.cfm/access-land#ixzz0i9tTDxPg

 

 

http://walking-tours.suite101.com/article.cfm/access-land

[lester]

"the right to roam" is no way a misnomer. It is a basic right that those who try to maintain land can be owned and probably by them, have been trying to restrict since adam. Claiming otherwise is an attempt to hoodwink the gullible.

[cycas]

No, this isn't privately owned access land opened up by the CROW act.

 

It is a public park, given to the people of Cornwall in 1985, used for dogwalking for the last 25 years (probably more) and administered by Cornwall County Council.

 

Lester, there are certainly ground nesting birds on Kit Hill. No question. I know a lark when I hear it: I walk there most days, and regularly see plovers and lapwings. In case I was somehow mistaken in my own identifications, I also run a website for a local wildlife organisation that has done studies on the subject. I still think though that there is no good justification for dogs to be on the lead there for 5 months of the year.

Edited March 14, 2010 by cycas

[blackmagic]

Have you looked at KC DOG site

 

http://www.thekennelclub.org.uk/kcdog

[cycas]

Thanks, that's handy, will have a look.

 

I have had a long talk with one of the wardens this morning: I think I talked her round to some extent - she's a dog owner herself and her dog is offlead on the hill while she's working.

 

Her original stance was 'well we won't enforce it unless there's a problem' - to my mind that's not good enough, there are insurance implications, (not just for individuals either: the area is used by rescue fosterers and dogwalkers) and it creates a precedent that could seriously bite us all on the bum. I don't feel 'oh well I had an informal chat with Jenny and she said it was OK' is going to stand up against any kind of serious legal interest somehow.

She's going to talk to the other wardens and council about this and give me a response by the end of this month: if I need to start a campaign that still gives me a month to get the nutcrackers on all our local parliamentary candidates before the election.

[Houndwoman]

We were reminded about this when we took our GCKC Gold at our dog club last year and were given a booklet and it was one of the questions as part of our test.

 

Here is the info' here http://www.naturalengland.org.uk/ourwork/enjoying/countrysidecode/keepdogs.aspx

[cycas]

What I'm hoping is to get the main paths around the hill and a couple of the open areas recognised as 'public paths' (ie, dogs under control, but not on lead) . This would give pretty good offlead space provision all year, and would also mean that the bird nesting areas would have a realistic chance.

 

At the moment, nobody wins: because the area is such an important dog resource they would need to have multiple wardens all over the hill all day to even begin to get all the dogs on lead, and because the rule is seen as so stupid and excessive by the dogwalkers, it's going to be completely ignored.

 

But I'm not happy just ignoring it: I think it puts my own liability insurance at risk if I am ignoring the signs, quite apart from the whole 'precedent' issue . Further, if I and other rescue fosterers and the people who train guide dogs and hearing dogs are all walking dogs owned by charities up there offlead, we're putting the charity's liability insurance at risk too.

[Houndwoman]

It really is a pain I know but done for a good reason I expect Where we are here is so restrictive anyway as there is so much livestock around so we are quite used to having the dogs under close control or on leads and of course having Beagles restricts us anyway

 

ETA I meant KCGC in case I confuse anyone(I always get it bum about face)

[one.eyed.dog]

I know this is childish but, the sign does not say the owner has to be holding the lead. Just dog must be on a lead. So, technically, if the lead was really short and tucked up so the dog could not trip on it, it's on a lead.