Wendbert Posted May 18, 2006 Report Share Posted May 18, 2006 his mothers side, But it takes two to produce the pups, so if you don't know the parentage of your dog's dad, you are not producing good lines To be honest, you really need to sort out the dogs problems rather than think about breeding: firstly he kept escaping also he would pee in the house occasionally agressive to other male dogs protective and can become a bit funny its the recalling problem i have with him. I seriously think some of these problems will be eased with neutering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest manchester_terrier_lover Posted May 18, 2006 Report Share Posted May 18, 2006 ok i have always wanted him to be able to show my dog, i want him to one day do agility he loves jumping and is great at it, he does every trick in the book he can dance. i might just take him o a specialist to see thier views on him, as it is un explainable to which level these problem hes has, there are plenty worse dogs out there and im just trying to improve, all dogs have thier high and lows. Neuter it is! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wendbert Posted May 18, 2006 Report Share Posted May 18, 2006 Ok, Shall I close this now then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
border collie Posted May 18, 2006 Report Share Posted May 18, 2006 I hope this doesn't offend you, but how old are you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest manchester_terrier_lover Posted May 18, 2006 Report Share Posted May 18, 2006 Ok and will get back to everyone in need of help for his problems to be sorted thanks everyone... 18 yes i am young and yes i know... night will be back on tomorrow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snow Posted May 18, 2006 Report Share Posted May 18, 2006 ok i have always wanted him to be able to show my dog, i want him to one day do agility he loves jumping and is great at it, he does every trick in the book he can dance. i might just take him o a specialist to see thier views on him, as it is un explainable to which level these problem hes has, there are plenty worse dogs out there and im just trying to improve, all dogs have thier high and lows. That is admirable Chazy, to want to improve both yours and becks quality of life, however, the behavioural issues and the breeding issue are interlinked. Many of becks issues could be assisted by neutering, which would not prevent you from showing him or doing agility with him. If he's aggressive towards other dogs he simply won't be welcome in many clubs. Similarly for showing, if he were to snap at a dog in the ring or god forbid at the judge, it won't matter one jot how lovely looking he is, he would not be representative of the breed and would be displaying breed characteristics that are very negative and not welcomed in the bloodlines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happylittlegreensquirrel Posted May 19, 2006 Report Share Posted May 19, 2006 I do beginners agility with my collie cross Holly and the only requirement for dogs to join the class is that they must be okay with other dogs on and off lead Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~Canis-Equus~ Posted May 19, 2006 Report Share Posted May 19, 2006 (edited) It probably feels right now that everyone is jumping on you (stop bouncing you lot)... there is a great reason for them to do this though. For one thing, your dog is not KC registered, that means you cannot show him against others of his breed in any 'official' capacity so you cannot get a good perspective from OTHER people (and that is very important, we ALL think our own dogs are fantastic where others, more removed from the situation can see their flaws)..... and compare him to more of his breed. I suspect there probably arent 'millions' of manchester terriers out there in rescues, but there ARE hundreds of dogs dying in pounds every day who people got rid of because of problems you describe in your own dog, some people will dump a dog for just ONE of thsoe problems, for some peeing in the house isnt a huge deal - in fact i have two house-pee'ers...., for others its an absolute nightmare that they cannot cope with. Most of his issues sound behavioural, however until you have trained him and put in a lot of work with some expert help (and beware those, everyone is one and many of them are utter rubbish, and some of them are dangerous!!!).... you wont know what is just a phase, a symptom of youth and perhaps a lack of socialisation, or a deeper more serious problem. Some of his traits would seem to be to be 'terrierish', they are barky they are opinionated and stubborn and a great many will wade into a scrap with a much bigger dog with very little justification. Yours sounds more so, and id say htat comes from his father - so if you WERE a responsible breeder in so far as youd take any pups back, how would it be if an ENTIRE litter were returned to you because they all displayed the traits of the father and grandfather??? Ill tell you now, a house full of teenage terriers is my worst nightmare, im sure folk on here would agree, even if they DIDNT have dodgy parentage behind them. You say you want to breed not for the money... but to have a 'replica' of a dog you have found so hard to handle you have sent him back to live with other family members.... you knwo and love your dog yet YOU are struggling, quite clearly to cope with him - why would his puppies be any easier, temperament problems are VERY easily passed on! I know how it feels to loev a dog dearly and want to keep them forever in their descendents, im sure we all do, but i can tell you from experience of those who HAVE done that, that way heartache lies. The son of your dog will not BE your dog - he will look like him and behave similarly to him (and the people i knew even gave the 'replacement' teh same NAME...)..... but you will constantly and forever compare him to your previous dog and be dissapointed because the human brain plays silly tricks on us, we forget how horrendous the previous one could be, in our minds he turns into a saint of dogdom.... Forget breeding, knock that on the head mate, its expensive, its not going to make you happy, you stand the chance of which ever bitch is used being ill, expensively ill or dying, and the pups the same, and if all goes well there, you stand a very great risk of his pups being problems themselves and being passed back to you later on in life. Figure out how to deal with your dogs problems and give it a go, it may take MONTHS, but work out what they are and how to solve it - consider when you have done that, getting him neutered (some may disagree but personally id rather solve the current problems first, then neuter and solve any that that may bring up - usually very few but its best to know first!). It is not 'normal' for entire dogs to be horrible to other dogs - this is behaviour of fiesty dogs who have not been educated or socialised properly so dont go expecting to lop his nuts off and change him, he could become MORE fearful and MORE aggressive. Training training training, and some more training, make him a confident happy dog and ill bet the weeing in the house stops too... then have him neutered and enjoy him for who he is. Just to add.... many many people have found that once a dog has been mated with a bitch, he wants to do that again and again and he will fight for his right to do so. Even my NEUTERED boy will do this because he accidentally got his way wtih a bitch the day AFTER he had been done.... every so often he sees his chance and he will be off after a girl and woe betide the dog that gets in his way. Fortunately i have learned how to curb this, but its a bit of a shock to the system if you previously thought that it wouldnt have any effect at all. Some dogs who have been mated are nigh on impossible to live with and have around bitches or other males. Em Edited May 19, 2006 by ~Canis-Equus~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindsay Posted May 19, 2006 Report Share Posted May 19, 2006 For general help try www.apdt.co.uk for a good trainer hopefully near to you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest manchester_terrier_lover Posted May 23, 2006 Report Share Posted May 23, 2006 thanks for that Em, i have some one that i can understand and that understands me, yes i have a list of things i could say about my dog but i was 12 when i owned him and to bring him up sosialising him was a slight problem. There were not many dogd in my area he is great with people but depends on how they approach him, my term on getting funny was not to the visious type, more like he can fear of people, someone has run him ove with a push bike someone has set thier dog on him and him spending 4 years in a house with garden with no dogs running about then have a male rottweiler holding his head over the next doors neighbours fence give him the best of suprises. in fact the dog would bark at him. and twa sthen to a stage where becks would pine to meet him, one night my brother girlfriend let him out in the garden and when brother went to let him in sounded like ww3 out in the neighbours garden with my dog in another dog mouth we thought he was dead james my brother ran and jumped over the fence the dog dropped him and left my dog with a nice scar above his shoulders and neck. full on moth round the neck, so thats not the best of experiences hes had, he had a best friend called charlie, but he moved to jersey, and a staffy girl called poppy, and lots of friends, he was sound with any dogs he has met. I have taken him to shows he takes not so much notice as to what the dog next door is doing but waiting for the next thing to happen, peeing in the house is something he started doing when he was 2 or 3. but it happens only once or maybe twice a week. for me, i think he would be capible of learning without being neutered and you hear thing like you have said may make them worse or make no difference at all, they can gain wait lose weight. whether the weight problems are true are unknown but i have had people tell me their dogs became overweight when being neutered. yes he is being trained and i think maybe taking him to some more classes. for a bit more learning. i believe i can do this. and i know he can loose these issues. a workman who was interested in my dog was working on our house for a few days. and my dog became good friends, and he said to me then he had been spoilt of his pining. we have no gates. and so he was tethered that day on a long lead so he could wonder about. but when he could not reach somewhere (he hates being alone and loves following you) he would pine. And that is then main problem i want to solve. of all things. that is it everything else is no problem. people love him he love people he loves town. workers know him shop keepers bankers, and to be honest. he just gets on with it. none of them have ever seen a manchester terrier. so when i took him to town at christmas. people took photos. he had tinsel round his feet and a piece round his neck one or two other dogs had done similar. round the neck. but he loves it. sorry to upset anyone. i was selfish to think what i did. so no hard feelings. i wont ever give him up! hes my water bottle lol charlotte x Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanie Posted June 28, 2006 Report Share Posted June 28, 2006 Hi Chazy! Manchester Terriers are fantastic dogs! Why not join one of the Manchester Terrier clubs? I am sure they would welcome a new member. Go to the Kennel Club website and then into Discover Dogs and then into Manchester Terrier and you should find some addresses. I agree Becks may benefit from neutering, but it sounds to me as though you have been trying to do your best with a very smart and lively dog from quite a young age and as you are obviously so devoted to the breed, you could always watch some MT judging and maybe even go to some breed seminars to learn more about what makes a good Manchester - even if you can't show Becks! Often breed clubs are run by a handful of people who would really love to welcome an extra pair of hands to help out at shows with serving teas, setting up the ringside etc. This is what I do at my breed club and it is a great way to meet people with years of experience and learn a lot. As for training, why not try to sit in on a class or two at several different classes in your area without Becks - just so you can have a good think about how the dogs and handlers are treated and the methods that are used, before taking the plunge and enrolling? Have a look in the vet's for details. Lok out for a class where the handlers look relaxed; there are no choke chains and the exercises are kept short and varied (essential for terriers!) Also avoid classes where the instructor pulls a face like this when you say you have a terrier! A really good book to read (you may have to order it on the internet) is The Culture Clash by Jean Donaldson - it could have been written for terriers! I hope everything works out well for you. It is great to hear from someone who is so enthusiastic about a good old native breed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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