EAD Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 Kyla is on week 10 of her recovery after cruciate surgery and we are now up to walking 50 minutes onlead. 99% of the walk she is great and will walk to heel but if we meet another dog she pulls like a steam train to get over to it which I dont want her to. She is walked on a half check collar and I recently tried just looping her long lead across her chest which does help a bit but obviously I dont have full control with that. Im loathe to use a head collar and have been looking at different harnesses and thought the Halti harness looked quite good though I read this about it...... (It does work very well but I think it's really important to make sure that your dog doesn't just have a walk on the harness every day. They need to be able to let off steam with a good run or at least have a good wander and a sniff without any restrictions. In my experience dogs can get frustrated if they're kept under too much control all the time and then you get unwanted behaviour such as chewing or barking). Now im wondering if this harness is too restrictive bearing in mind that for most of the walk Kyla is very good and I only want extra control when meeting other dogs. Any thoughts from harness experts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudi Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 I've used the Canac harnesses before and found them fine. I don't see why the harness would be any more restrictive than a collar in a way, so long as it's fitted properly I've always wondered if they aren't actually more comfortable. Working dogs are often put in harnesses and move about okay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mags Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 When I got Bruno boxer, he was just a nightmare. He was a lunging choking lunatic. After trying many things, including a head collar which he absolutely hated, I finally got a Halti front fastening harness. This is magic and we have the most relaxing walks now. He didn't need any extra time to get used to it and I feel like I have total control over him. What's the difference between the dog being on a collar and lead, or on a harness and lead? I don't really get that comment about the harness being too restrictive. I can't recommend this harness enough but make sure it's the front fastening one. This is a link that will give you some info on it. (Mods if it's not ok to have this link, please remove) Halti Harness Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EAD Posted June 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 This is the link for the page I read it on though maybe I have taken it the wrong way Mags its the front attached one I thought looked good and she will get off lead all being well over the next few weeks so wont be harnessed all the time Rudi I also looked at the Canac harness but wasnt sure how much control that would give me if she kicks off at another dog Dont have the cash to go trying every harness on the market so would be great to get it right 1st time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mags Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 I've never bothered attaching a lead up at the shoulders also. I just attach it under his chin. If he tries to pull, he just kinda gets pulled back to face me. Hope that makes sense. I think I read somewhere that these harnesses shouldnt be used with a flexi lead. But I use a flexi lead on Bruno all the time and never had a problem. If I bring him out on his own along the canal, I can let him off lead so he still gets a run. But if I have Misty Westie and Bob Terrier cross with me also (who I certainly cant let off lead, selective hearing lol), I dont let Bruno off lead as I dont think it would be fair. Before I got this harness, there is no way that I could walk the three dogs at the same time. Now I can with absolute pleasure. Forgot to mention, I also have one of these harnesses for Bob. Now while he's only a small dog and I could manage him pulling, I didn't like him choking himself. Again, no acclimatisation was needed for it. Just put it on and off you go. I'd be interested to hear how you get on with it if you do get one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReikiAnge Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 What's the difference between the dog being on a collar and lead, or on a harness and lead? I don't really get that comment about the harness being too restrictive. I don't get that either, the dog is on lead and under lead control either way. I use harnesses for mine and I prefer them and I don't feel the dogs feel more restricted than being attached at the neck. Wearing a harness doesn't mean they can't go offlead. I use the Mekuti harnesses for mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudi Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 I've never bothered attaching a lead up at the shoulders also. I just attach it under his chin. If he tries to pull, he just kinda gets pulled back to face me. Hope that makes sense. I think I read somewhere that these harnesses shouldnt be used with a flexi lead. I'd rather use a flexi lead with a harness than a collar or headcollar, there's probably less damage done if the dog is moving quickly and suddenly stops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khanu Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 i don't think the comment was about the harness physically restricting movement. more that you are removing the opportunity for the dog to wander and sniff when using an anti-pull harness (or head collar I imagine) as you are basically insisting that they must walk to heel, close to you all the time. However I insist that my dogs walk to heel close to me all the time without using an anti pull harness. I just make sure that i also have a cue that means ok you can't pull me about the place but you can wander and sniff. I use "with me" to mean walk close to me at heel, no sniffing, pausing or peeing. And "go sniff" to mean no pulling but you can wander and I'll let you pee (that is mainly for Syd's benefit as he gets to go off lead less than the others cos he bogs off). Personally I think you need to train Kyla to walk to heel around distractions - she can obviously do it for certain distractions, you just need to up the anti and get her to do it around other dogs too. However I don't think the halti harness is going to be restrictive, she can still wear it when she goes off lead so she will still have the opportunity to go sniff, and be a dog. Also be aware that in the halti (and gentle leader) harnesses that dogs can spin around in them - it'll prevent her pulling, but since it works by using that pulling momentum to turn the dog into you it can allow persistent dogs (like Khanu!) to get into a spin which I find far harder to control. For Khanu I always like using a double attachment, a head halter, with a second attachment on a normal harness, this allows me to balance him and prevents him spinning and lunging since i have two contact points. However I suspect that Kyla doesn't have the issues Khanu does! May be worth looking at the mekuti harnesses, they use a double attachment principle too (to just the harness) and I know quite a few people that have used them successfully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EAD Posted June 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 Yeah I think I misread it Like I said Kyla will walk very well beside me and is fine with dogs passing us at the other side of the street but if we met head on she would pull to get to them. She also knows and understands the words easy and wait which I use quite a lot. An example of recent sillyness from her Walking through the town and went to walk past a parked car on our right when a dog leapt up and started barking out the back window. She started pulling towards the car barking and then when I tried to pass she turned her head to the right and pushes her left rear side into my leg so when im trying to turn her head back towards me I find it really difficult. Added to that shes barking like something deranged and im feeling very embarassed thinking people are thinking this crazy woman cant control her even crazier dog In hindsight I should have just turned and walked the other way but it all happened so fast. If we meet a dog on the pavement coming towards us I keep Kyla on my right side but she will pull across the front of me to get to the dog and I press my knee into her side to move her back over again as I dont have the control with the half check. Btw she is about 36kgs. Dont want people reading this to think shes nuts all the time and its not with every dog either though I couldnt start to pin point type/colour/size/sex of dogs she reacts to. I do always carry treats and reward her if she walks past a dog without reacting. She is good off lead and will generally greet dogs quite timidly and is friendly I did use a canny collar on her a couple of years ago when she was just hitting adolescence but she seemed very flattened and unhappy when on a walk with it on which is why im reluctant to use one again. From what I can see the halti can be used with a double ended lead too though maybe it doesnt work the same as the Metuki Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khanu Posted June 22, 2008 Report Share Posted June 22, 2008 If she is being reactive then I would advocate a head collar with a second attachment to a normal harness (sorry I just thought you meant her heelwork went to pot around other dogs). The trick though is to find a good well fitting head collar that can be worn fairly loosely (not tight as it tends to as you said flatten the dog and be fairly aversive). With Khanu I keep the lead attached to the head collar low(I use a halti) so that there is no pressure ordinarily on it, then when I want to turn his head away, I drop the hand in front (the one holding the attachment to the halti) and lead him by the head in whatever direction, this means I am never applying pressure backwards onto his head and neck, only onto the noseband on his muzzle. My other hand that holds the attachment to the harness I hold behind me on the small of my back. I can balance him when walking normally using very light touches either to the harness or halti depending on how he is walking (it is far easier to show someone than to try to describe it though). This has worked beautifully in teaching him how to balance correctly when walking to heel (he used to use the tight lead to balance against when walking) and has the additional benefit of me being able to control him when he was at his absolute worse around other dogs. Nowadays he is far better, but i still use the double attachment when I think we may meet other dogs closer than he is totally comfortable with. The other thing you need to do really, is work out what the trigger is for Kyla to react. It may help to keep a notebook of when and where and to what she has reacted to, including what else has happened that day. If find that if Khanu has had a bad day, then he will be far more reactive to everything for the next couple of days. On those days, I just avoid his triggers - when he was very bad it meant that I ran to hide behind cars and in driveways to avoid him seeing another dog, or crossed the road and walked the other way. i would deliberately not let him get into situations where he could practise the behaviour and become more stressed, and only "worked" on his reactiveness when we were both in a good frame of mind and I could be fairly sure I could control the situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EAD Posted June 25, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 25, 2008 We managed to pass 2 dogs yesterday at other side of street without kicking off and she gave one woof at dog on our side of street which I think was because it was so close to us. Today I crossed road as I saw a woman coming with a JR and didnt want her being silly but she just stared at it. I will keep a check on when/what she reacts to and hopefully see a pattern. Will have a nosey at what headcollars/harnesses are out there. Thanks for the advice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EAD Posted June 29, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 29, 2008 Ok after a bit of pondering ive bought the halti harness with double ended lead. Walked her today with it and I feel a lot more in control. She did bark at a German Shepherd passing us on the pavement but to be fair it was hyped up and barking at us before it was even near us so I would have been very surprised if she has passed it quietly. If I find the harness doesnt help i'll think more about the headcollar as a last option. Thanks for the advice and replies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colliemad Posted July 2, 2008 Report Share Posted July 2, 2008 I also use the Halti harness with a double ended lead and its great for my BC who used to pull and lunge. I use the long line on the harness if I dont want him to be off lead and I have never had a problem with it. I m going to buy a second Halti harness for my BC pup as she slips out of other harnesses I have tried. With this one having a ring attached to her collar at the front she wont be able to do this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EAD Posted July 29, 2008 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2008 Just updating this to say im still really happy with the halti harness apart from connector rings looking a tad rusty already She does go in and out of the sea with it on though I do rinse it off and leave it up to dry afterwards. We have had a couple of incidents with dogs and the harness has been great though im trying to avoid giving her the choice of being stroppy. She acted silly on Saturday night when a man and couple of kids were approaching us, and she kicked off barking and trying to lunge. I held her collar which flipping popped open so off to P&H on Sunday for a buckle collar and have now decided not to walk her were kids will be in close proximity as its too risky as I dont want to muzzle her Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yena Posted July 31, 2008 Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 Had the same problem with Yena's Halti, if she twisted it came off. Eventually, she wore a Halti and a harness attached to a double lead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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