Fee Posted September 13, 2007 Report Share Posted September 13, 2007 I'm trying to train Taz to do an emergency down, but I'm struggling at the moment. The way I've trained my other dogs is to down them in the middle of a recall. With Taz I'm getting nowhere - partly because he's so damned fast (saluki lurcher) that if he's headed towards me he's back before I can get the command out and his brain has time to process it partly also I think his current understanding of 'down' is 'come here and lie down', so if I give the command when he's just mooching around he runs back to me first then goes down. I thought I might try getting someone else to hold him on lead so I could give the command from a distance without him charging over to me - then I'd run to him and reward the down. Does that sound like a reasonable starting point, or has anyone got any other ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JACKYSIAN Posted September 13, 2007 Report Share Posted September 13, 2007 Oh will watch this with interest. Tiz does down from stay at a distance but if I just tell her down while she's pottering (staffyx don't do running like your lurchers!! ) she comes to me then goes down! Also sometimes in down she does her frog dog impression and drags herself on her belly!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReikiAnge Posted September 13, 2007 Report Share Posted September 13, 2007 Am no training expert but if you work with someone else holding him on the lead, could they not give him the reward as soon as he's done it, so it's a much more immediate reward and easier for him to associate it with the down? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fee Posted September 13, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 13, 2007 Am no training expert but if you work with someone else holding him on the lead, could they not give him the reward as soon as he's done it, so it's a much more immediate reward and easier for him to associate it with the down? I would click the 'down' anyway, so he had an immediate marker that he'd done the right thing. The problem with Taz is that if someone else started giving him treats I suspect they'd also get his complete attention and he'd lose interest in anything I was saying altogether Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JACKYSIAN Posted September 13, 2007 Report Share Posted September 13, 2007 The problem with Taz is that if someone else started giving him treats I suspect they'd also get his complete attention and he'd lose interest in anything I was saying altogether The more you talk about Taz the more I think him and Tiz are related!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanishPastry Posted September 13, 2007 Report Share Posted September 13, 2007 how about just using a totally new word, that he won't connect with the down where he comes and lay down next to you. Start close and then gradually ask for more distance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fee Posted September 13, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 13, 2007 how about just using a totally new word, that he won't connect with the down where he comes and lay down next to you. Start close and then gradually ask for more distance. A new word is a good idea It's the 'gradually asking for more distance' bit I'm stuck with in a way, though. Even if he's standing just a few feet from me, if I say 'down' he trots over and lies down next to me and I'm not sure how to stop him doing the same thing with a new command? Actually this may be a case where a greedy dog and reward-based training don't work well. He's very much a dog who 'trades' his behaviour for treats, so perhaps he wants to be near the source of the treats before he does the command in case he doesn't get one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanishPastry Posted September 13, 2007 Report Share Posted September 13, 2007 while he is still close to you, try throw the treat on th ground to him, that way he might realize he doesn't have to be up close to get his reward. I think you also have to be very very patient, and not expect huge amount of progress to begin with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fee Posted September 13, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 13, 2007 Good idea re throwing the treats, I'll give that a try I think you also have to be very very patient, and not expect huge amount of progress to begin with. Lol, this is Taz, the dog who spent three days trying to out-stare a stone cat ornament on our neighbour's shed roof He certainly isn't the sharpest knife in the drawer and training him can be quite frustrating sometimes, but I love working with him because once he's 'got' something he's sooo happy and proud of himself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanishPastry Posted September 14, 2007 Report Share Posted September 14, 2007 Lol, this is Taz, the dog who spent three days trying to out-stare a stone cat ornament on our neighbour's shed roof :laugh: Indy feels for him, that is SO something she could have done! Indy doesn't really like to do down from a distance either, and I have not trained it much, but I might have found inspiration to get started now. We can compare progress if you like Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissMagic Posted November 5, 2007 Report Share Posted November 5, 2007 I'm having a bit of bother with 'lie down' myself, new tactics needed to show her what I want! I tried the technique where you entice them under your legs and then gently push them down to a lying a position and then reward but she doesn't seem to be getting it *scratches head* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fee Posted November 5, 2007 Author Report Share Posted November 5, 2007 I'm having a bit of bother with 'lie down' myself, new tactics needed to show her what I want! I tried the technique where you entice them under your legs and then gently push them down to a lying a position and then reward but she doesn't seem to be getting it *scratches head* I'm not a fan of physically pushing or pulling dogs into position. Lying down is quite a vulnerable position for a dog, and they may resist being pushed or even be frightened by it. To teach a basic 'down' I've always used a treat to lure the dog down from a 'sit'. I kneel in front of the dog and hold the treat in front of his nose then take it straight down to the floor he will usually follow it. If he crouches instead of lying down properly it can help to push the treat forward a little bit in between his front legs. The minute he lies down I praise and reward. Once I've done it a few times and can lure him down reliably (and hopefully he's now starting to get the idea of what I want) I start to put the command in as I move the treat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackmagic Posted November 5, 2007 Report Share Posted November 5, 2007 reinforce the down postion when she is lying down already. Sit on the floor with her and, when she lies down of her own accord, tell her 'down' and stroke and praise her. In time she will associate the word with the position. To practice a 'down' do it after a walk, when the dog is tired and will probably be going to lie down anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissMagic Posted November 6, 2007 Report Share Posted November 6, 2007 reinforce the down postion when she is lying down already. Sit on the floor with her and, when she lies down of her own accord, tell her 'down' and stroke and praise her. In time she will associate the word with the position. To practice a 'down' do it after a walk, when the dog is tired and will probably be going to lie down anyway. I'll try that I've tried luring her into position but that doesn't work, I'm wondering if it's because of the shape of her body that she can't follow her nose down like that. She's a leggy Staff who's naturally a bit clumsy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cycas Posted November 6, 2007 Report Share Posted November 6, 2007 I bet she can follow her nose down if she has sufficient motivation - what are you using as a lure? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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